Chris Watkins
Chris Watkins

The bigger question here is; Do you trust everything the CDC and the Government tell you?
That is the primary reason people are refusing vaccines.
I know vaccines can be good, but I don't trust a damned thing any government agency says without unbiased proof.
They have lied to the public enough times to warrant suspicion.
No matter what the "professionals" say I have witnessed my child near death within days after being vaccinated. The doctors don't know why but refuse to accept that the...

The bigger question here is; Do you trust everything the CDC and the Government tell you?
That is the primary reason people are refusing vaccines.
I know vaccines can be good, but I don't trust a damned thing any government agency says without unbiased proof.
They have lied to the public enough times to warrant suspicion.
No matter what the "professionals" say I have witnessed my child near death within days after being vaccinated. The doctors don't know why but refuse to accept that the vaccine was a possibility.
What I learned from that experience was that any negative effects of vaccines go unreported.

Andrea Leong
Andrea Leong
  • Chris Watkins

"[...] any negative effects of vaccines go unreported."

I think you'll find that (for example) the Infanrix DTaP vaccine insert lists SIDS as a reported adverse reaction. Not because there's any evidence the vaccine caused it, mind you, but because some random reported it following vaccination. Given that SIDS occurs more frequently in the unvaccinated, we have to be extremely sceptical about any causal link.
http://us.gsk.com/products/assets/us_infanrix.pdf

The Pneumovax23 insert lists...

"[...] any negative effects of vaccines go unreported."

I think you'll find that (for example) the Infanrix DTaP vaccine insert lists SIDS as a reported adverse reaction. Not because there's any evidence the vaccine caused it, mind you, but because some random reported it following vaccination. Given that SIDS occurs more frequently in the unvaccinated, we have to be extremely sceptical about any causal link.
http://us.gsk.com/products/assets/us_infanrix.pdf

The Pneumovax23 insert lists serious side effects that occurred during trials; these occurred in 6/1008 vaccinations and 4/1008 placebo doses. Some idiot reported "alcohol intoxication". http://www.merck.com/product/usa/pi_circulars/p/pneumovax_23/pneumovax_pi.pdf

Vaccines have very rare serious side effects, but these are always listed --- there is no conspiracy to hide them. Seriously, the risk to the individual is less than than the risk involved in not vaccinating. Parents of children who had bad reactions need to keep this in mind and not feel guilty.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Chris Watkins

It's probably because the doctors, who are more qualified than you to say so, have determined that the vaccine was not responsible. While you yourself are perfectly capable of reporting the reaction to VAERS (I'll assume you're from the US), the doctors are not required to do so if they have legitimate reason not to. Get the medical records from them and get a second opinion - that's another option. But blaming them and questioning their ethical integrity without taking the steps you have...

It's probably because the doctors, who are more qualified than you to say so, have determined that the vaccine was not responsible. While you yourself are perfectly capable of reporting the reaction to VAERS (I'll assume you're from the US), the doctors are not required to do so if they have legitimate reason not to. Get the medical records from them and get a second opinion - that's another option. But blaming them and questioning their ethical integrity without taking the steps you have available to CHECK YOUR DAMN FACTS will be ignored in light of the fact that the experts, who have vastly more experience and knowledge than you on the topic of medical matters, are telling you the vaccines have nothing to do with it.

While it would be unwise to take the word of the government without indeed checking claims that might be categorised as questionable at best, pretending the answer hasn't been provided when it clearly has can only result in a "fishing trip" leading you into the murky waters of scams, misinformation, and conspiracy theories.

If the doctors say your son's sickness was not the result of vaccination, then they are likely correct. If you'd gone for a second opinion, and it disagreed with the first, then you might have a leg to stand on, but all you have here is anecdote.

When I was vaccinated, my IQ quickly rose 100 points and I gained superhuman strength.

You see what I did there? When you understand why you don't believe my anecdote, you'll understand why we don't believe yours.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Chris Watkins

It's not about trust, it's about confirmation. I personally don't trust anyone, but when the data supports what they're saying, then at least I can defer to them as knowing what they're talking about. When it doesn't, then I have a reason not to believe them. This doesn't mean, however, that I'm not prepared to hear them out if they can find NEW EVIDENCE to support their claim, and if it checks out, then I'm again happy to defer.

Chris Watkins
Chris Watkins
  • Chris Watkins

What good would a second opinion do when I have nothing to investigate upon?
Without a batch # from the vaccine or a sample to have analyzed, I have absolutely nothing.
So the second opinion will have even less credibility than the first.
I would bet money they are not going to release a sample to me so I can have it analyzed.
Maybe the vaccine was tainted with something besides what it was intended to treat.
This would lead to the doctor claiming that a menningitis vaccine could not have...

What good would a second opinion do when I have nothing to investigate upon?
Without a batch # from the vaccine or a sample to have analyzed, I have absolutely nothing.
So the second opinion will have even less credibility than the first.
I would bet money they are not going to release a sample to me so I can have it analyzed.
Maybe the vaccine was tainted with something besides what it was intended to treat.
This would lead to the doctor claiming that a menningitis vaccine could not have caused the symptoms of something completly unrelated to menningitis.
I may not be a medical expert, but even a fool knows something's wrong when their healthy active child is hospitalized for a week within a couple days after immunizations.
So I go back to my claim that Immunizations can be good, but the medical establishment, and government need to provide a means for investigative follow up when something seems wrong.
In short, give us a reason to feel confident about the process, instead of calling us fools or idiots because we don't lie down and agree with everything we are told.

Lynne Batik
Lynne Batik
  • Chris Watkins

You know, you really ought to read Paul Offit's book "Deadly Choices." He details exactly what those investigative followups are, and how they have been used to track down real problems, when they occur, and how they haven't supported allegations of others. But when you don't know that something exists, that doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Right?

Lynne Batik
Lynne Batik
  • Chris Watkins

If you want to find out what the investigative process IS when "something seems wrong", then I honestly suggest you read "Deadly Choices", by Paul Offitt.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Chris Watkins

Unless something else happened inside those couple of days after the vaccine. Why do you need a sample of the vaccine when if the vaccine was causing the problem, a sample of it would be inside your child causing the problem?

FYI, the "medical establishment" is not the government, they have no reason to lie to you, or make this stuff up. I wouldn't say you're a fool, but I would say you aren't qualified to make the determination that the correlation of the vaccine being delivered prior to...

Unless something else happened inside those couple of days after the vaccine. Why do you need a sample of the vaccine when if the vaccine was causing the problem, a sample of it would be inside your child causing the problem?

FYI, the "medical establishment" is not the government, they have no reason to lie to you, or make this stuff up. I wouldn't say you're a fool, but I would say you aren't qualified to make the determination that the correlation of the vaccine being delivered prior to your son's sickness equates to a cause. I still remember a story about a girl who had a massive fit only moments before she was due for a vaccine of some kind. If that vaccine had been delivered sooner, and she'd had the same fit, than any parent might have made the same correlation. Fortunately, medical professionals know better than to jump to such hasty conclusions.

Kyllie Balazs
Kyllie Balazs
  • Chris Watkins

MMR has caused most of the concerns and possibility of autism links, so why don't we separate measles, mumps , rubella as originally and get vaccination uptake rates up again . It's STILL being researched this issue, so stop wasting money , change it back and get confidence back again. Have it as an option as separate vaccines instead of scraping combination one all together and parents make their own decision. After all no one likes being pushed and should value a parents concern after all .

Suzy Que
Suzy Que

How We Know Vaccines are Safe.
Vaccine safety cannot be measured directly. Instead, it is estimated by the number of “adverse events” reported. An adverse event is “...a medical incident that takes place after an immunization...and is believed to be caused by the immunization.”.

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/Vaccine_Monitoring/Index.html

That's comforting, I feel so much better now.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Suzy Que

Nevertheless, I began to read the study... and stopped short at the part where he went into "an analysis of the Vaccine Adverse Events Reporting System (VAERS) database". Do you know why I stopped there? Because VAERS is conclusive of nothing. VAERS alone is a reporting system, as it's name suggests. That is, you can call up and report whatever you like, and it gets recorded on VAERS. They record it for investigation, and the investigation of VAERS reports determines the accuracy of the...

Nevertheless, I began to read the study... and stopped short at the part where he went into "an analysis of the Vaccine Adverse Events Reporting System (VAERS) database". Do you know why I stopped there? Because VAERS is conclusive of nothing. VAERS alone is a reporting system, as it's name suggests. That is, you can call up and report whatever you like, and it gets recorded on VAERS. They record it for investigation, and the investigation of VAERS reports determines the accuracy of the reports. You can call up and report a stubbed to as an adverse event following a vaccination, and they will record it. I wonder how the rate of stubbed toes has changed since certain vaccines have been introduced? Maybe we can draw up a correlation from VAERS reports and blame that on "toxic vaccines" as well.

This study is trash. Junk science. Analysing VAERS for data on vaccine-caused reactions is like citing Wikipedia for your doctoral thesis.

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Suzy Que

How We Know Vaccines are Safe.
Vaccine safety cannot be measured directly. Instead, it is estimated by the number of “adverse events” reported. An adverse event is “...a medical incident that takes place after an immunization...and is believed to be caused by the immunization.”.

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/Vaccine_Monitoring/Index.html

That's comforting, I feel so much better now.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Suzy Que

Although I know you're being sarcastic, I'm wondering if you've actually read through that in it's entirety, particularly the part where "Adverse events include...Events that would have occurred even if the person had not yet been vaccinated (unrelated consequences).

Which is why VAERS reports aren't used for conclusive data analysis.

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Suzy Que

Yes Martin, I did read through it. There's not much out there that IS conclusive, no matter what you present here, that is just my point. CDC know it, plenty of DRs know it, I know it, heaps of people here know it, on and on I could go. So again I get back to my main issue, which is: When and until vaccines and their preseratives, antibiotics, adjuvants etc are proven safe in EVERY aspect using the guildlines as set out in the Sears article for a start, I reserve my right to be concerned...

Yes Martin, I did read through it. There's not much out there that IS conclusive, no matter what you present here, that is just my point. CDC know it, plenty of DRs know it, I know it, heaps of people here know it, on and on I could go. So again I get back to my main issue, which is: When and until vaccines and their preseratives, antibiotics, adjuvants etc are proven safe in EVERY aspect using the guildlines as set out in the Sears article for a start, I reserve my right to be concerned enough not give any further vaccines to myself or my family when and until they are old enough to choose for themselves. Go back to studying Martin, I'm sure you are doing something more worthwhile than this. I'm logging out :)

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Suzy Que

Are you going to stop wearing seatbelts now? Because they also have the potential to cause serious injury in an accident. You might go flying through the windshield, but hey, as long as you're not seatbelt-injured, right?

Your argument is a moot point in the face of the fact that every time you walk out the front door of your home, you're taking a risk. A calculated risk. Everything is a risk. EVERYTHING!!!! Calculating the risk of the vaccines vs the risk of facing the disease is part of...

Are you going to stop wearing seatbelts now? Because they also have the potential to cause serious injury in an accident. You might go flying through the windshield, but hey, as long as you're not seatbelt-injured, right?

Your argument is a moot point in the face of the fact that every time you walk out the front door of your home, you're taking a risk. A calculated risk. Everything is a risk. EVERYTHING!!!! Calculating the risk of the vaccines vs the risk of facing the disease is part of the process, and yes, vaccines are NOT perfect, but you are facing a FAR greater risk by not being vaccinated. So are you going to reserve the right to refuse to wear seatbelts as well?

Your risk perception is skewed by a number of things, not the least of which is your own arrogant self-assuredness. But there is nothing more worthwhile for me than making sure your crackpot ideas don't spread into any more of the population than the minority they already possess, which is why I'm studying journalism. Believe it or not, this is what I do. This and Xbox, of course.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Suzy Que

No 1 - there are millions of adults that were vaccinated as children that have developed just fine. Before vaccines, life expectancy was shorter, infant mortality rates were higher, and families were breeding like bunnies to keep up

No 2 - probably many. There are so many tiny irrelevant ones that may just go unnoticed. They are the most common, and most well known. Most parents don't even report crying, because that's what babies do - they cry.

No 3 - because an unvaccinated group...

No 1 - there are millions of adults that were vaccinated as children that have developed just fine. Before vaccines, life expectancy was shorter, infant mortality rates were higher, and families were breeding like bunnies to keep up

No 2 - probably many. There are so many tiny irrelevant ones that may just go unnoticed. They are the most common, and most well known. Most parents don't even report crying, because that's what babies do - they cry.

No 3 - because an unvaccinated group wouldn't be a control, because there are a pile of variables to consider, such as what the purpose of the testing would be in the first place. If it's autism, then an unvaccinated group is most certainly not a control group - it has been well established that autism occurs at the same rate in the unvaccinated as it does in the vaccinated.

Lynne Batik
Lynne Batik
  • Suzy Que

As an addition to No 3, because doctors must rely on those children who are selected out by their parents for an unvaccinated group, and these still make up a small minority -- and it is completely unethical to *create* an unvaccinated group, because the dangers of the diseases and the efficacy of vaccines against disease are already very well known and documented. There isn't an ethics review board in the world which would approve deliberately withholding the standard vaccines from...

As an addition to No 3, because doctors must rely on those children who are selected out by their parents for an unvaccinated group, and these still make up a small minority -- and it is completely unethical to *create* an unvaccinated group, because the dangers of the diseases and the efficacy of vaccines against disease are already very well known and documented. There isn't an ethics review board in the world which would approve deliberately withholding the standard vaccines from children, because some of those children would die because of the lack. It's what happens when you don't vaccinate against potentially fatal diseases.

And not all the squawking in the world by the anti-vaccinationists who cannot bring themselves to accept or understand this, can change it.

Lynne Batik
Lynne Batik
  • Suzy Que

The problems with this are very clearly explained here -- as is the German study on vaccinated vs. unvaccinated which I later saw mangled, distorted and utterly misreported on "NaturalNews" and other such anti-vaccine sources:

http://www.vaccinetimes.com/the-vaccinated-vs-unvaccinated-study-a-k-a-the-german-study/
http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2011/03/11/for-the-anti-vaccinationists-out-there-t/

Alan James Greaves
Alan James Greaves

Where are these disease they are no where to be seen, only vaccinated suffer the effects of diseases and victims of voodoo vaccines are covered up with relabeling their true conditions caused by the lethal vaccine poison, most drs do not report the victims because it would mean their wages would be reduced or they will be struck of from practicing in the corrupt field of medicine. Have you not been getting the CDC hints that vaccines create zombies and we call them pro-vaccine zombies but zombies (abbreviated of course).

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Alan James Greaves

Did you know that the diseases are rare these days because vaccines have been so successful? If vaccines are so lethal, then why are there millions of vaccinated people living healthy lives all over the world? Vaccines create zombies? That's a new one. If that was the case, the CDC wouldn't hint it, they would say it. You, sir, are a first-rate nut job.

Mistie Delorey
Mistie Delorey
  • Alan James Greaves

Actually the U.S. vaccinates the most of any country and has the highest infant and child death rates Martin, also if you take the time to look up the proper graphs you will see that all of the diseases that now have vaccines were essentially wiped out just prior to the introduction of each of their appropriate vaccines. Although I would not go so far as to say that vaccines create zombies, there is overwhelming evidence that vaccines are in some way responsible for our learning disability,...

Actually the U.S. vaccinates the most of any country and has the highest infant and child death rates Martin, also if you take the time to look up the proper graphs you will see that all of the diseases that now have vaccines were essentially wiped out just prior to the introduction of each of their appropriate vaccines. Although I would not go so far as to say that vaccines create zombies, there is overwhelming evidence that vaccines are in some way responsible for our learning disability, autism, seizures and SIDS epidemics in the western world. Not to mention the awakening of all the parents who are witnessing these conditions transpire. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5vpZSLW4ds
I don't have time to re-research all this and post it all but these are a few areas you might want to brush up on.

Bridie Burke
Bridie Burke
  • Alan James Greaves

HIghest rate of infant and child death ratees? Oh please...show me the studies that show this. But I am guessing you won't, because their are none. You just *know* it right? There isn't enough tinfoil in the world to respond to the comments on here.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Alan James Greaves

More correlation. Actually, the highest infant and child mortality rates are not in the US, and if you take the time to look up some real information that isn't biased, you'll find out which countries do (I'll give you a hint, they're in Africa and other parts of the third world). Diseases weren't wiped out prior to the vaccines - mortality was in decline, but the incidence rates did not decline until the introduction of vaccines. I have autism, and there is overwhelming evidence that it was...

More correlation. Actually, the highest infant and child mortality rates are not in the US, and if you take the time to look up some real information that isn't biased, you'll find out which countries do (I'll give you a hint, they're in Africa and other parts of the third world). Diseases weren't wiped out prior to the vaccines - mortality was in decline, but the incidence rates did not decline until the introduction of vaccines. I have autism, and there is overwhelming evidence that it was not caused by vaccines, and if SIDS was caused by vaccines, then it wouldn't be called SIDS. Have you listened to yourself lately? Parents who witness medical issues transpiring are seeing only part of the picture, the part that allows them to connect a correlation, but that is all. I'm sure you've done your research, but you've done it wrong, and I'm sure there are many areas that we both need to brush up on - me because I don't pretend I know everything, and you because you're clearly very mistaken.

Christopher Panzer
Christopher Panzer
  • Alan James Greaves

Autistic or not, Martin Bouchaert, there is no need for name calling.

Bridie Burke
Bridie Burke
  • Alan James Greaves

Christopher, am I missing something? Where did Martin name call?

Bridie Burke
Bridie Burke
  • Alan James Greaves

Sue Dick I asked you this in another thread, explain to me why allergies/asthma and autoimmune diseases are still found in the unvaccinated then. If it is all down to vaccines as you claim.

Christopher Panzer
Christopher Panzer
  • Alan James Greaves

That's a good one, Birdie. I believe we played like that when we were in grade school.

Wendy Ferris
Wendy Ferris

For all you who have stated that by not immunising our children are the ones who are spreading diseases! lease explain how you came to such a conclusion. Anyway if that was correct why are you worried you have vaccinated your child against the diseases so why are you so worried????

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Wendy Ferris

They are occurring in the vaccinated and unvaccinated alike. But you seem to be of the opinion that the majority are vaccinated - this may be so, but it's important to understand the statistical significance.

The majority of the population is vaccinated - a figure close to 85% is estimated to produce herd immunity. This means that if, out of 100 children, 15 are unvaccinated, and 85 are vaccinated, then the vaccinated children are a majority. So, if 20 vaccinated students get pertussis, and...

They are occurring in the vaccinated and unvaccinated alike. But you seem to be of the opinion that the majority are vaccinated - this may be so, but it's important to understand the statistical significance.

The majority of the population is vaccinated - a figure close to 85% is estimated to produce herd immunity. This means that if, out of 100 children, 15 are unvaccinated, and 85 are vaccinated, then the vaccinated children are a majority. So, if 20 vaccinated students get pertussis, and 15 (all) unvaccinated students get pertussis, then indeed, there are more vaccinated children getting it than vaccinated.

But when compared to the 65 children that don't get it, because they are vaccinated, you are looking at a successful vaccine. Of course, I have weighted these numbers inaccurately but on purpose to highlight a point - the vaccine is far more effective than that, and the unvaccinated are more susceptible to pertussis than the vaccinated.

Lisa Brooker
Lisa Brooker
  • Wendy Ferris

Vaccinations are there to help arent they? I want to help protect my child against diseases and illnesses

Wendy Ferris
Wendy Ferris
  • Wendy Ferris

If that was the case how come in Cananda a few months ago 100% vaccinated against the whooping cough yet 98% caught whooping cough.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Wendy Ferris

Don't know where you got those numbers, but they are bogus

Wendy Ferris
Wendy Ferris
  • Wendy Ferris

"In conclusion, vaccines are a perfect manifestation of everything that is satanic. They represent an adulterous and arrogant tampering with divine creation, based on the intellectual conceit of "perfecting" creation. They are poisonous, containing derivatives from metals such as mercury and aluminum, and from formaldehyde. They are made from the cell lines and viruses of biblically unclean animals such as monkeys, cats, etc. Worst of all, they are made from the cell lines of premeditatedly...

"In conclusion, vaccines are a perfect manifestation of everything that is satanic. They represent an adulterous and arrogant tampering with divine creation, based on the intellectual conceit of "perfecting" creation. They are poisonous, containing derivatives from metals such as mercury and aluminum, and from formaldehyde. They are made from the cell lines and viruses of biblically unclean animals such as monkeys, cats, etc. Worst of all, they are made from the cell lines of premeditatedly murdered children. When such abortion-derived vaccines are injected into other living human beings, a subtle form of cannibalism has occurred, a satanic sacrament has been partaken of, straight from the "table of demons" (1 Cor. 10:21)." -Bob Sperlazzo

Wendy Ferris
Wendy Ferris
  • Wendy Ferris

Lisa have you read any books on vaccines? Just wondering. Please educate before vaccinate. Both my sons are never had a vaccine and I breastfeed them both till they were 4years old. I Beleive that is so much better for there health then vaccines and formula. Both those products are just making the pharmaceutical comPanies richer.

Lisa Brooker
Lisa Brooker
  • Wendy Ferris

So the hospitals are giving out harmful vaccines that cause 'ill health' ... Why do they exist if according to you all they are so harmful? My son is 1 and he has never been ill.

Wendy Ferris
Wendy Ferris
  • Wendy Ferris

In one word YES. Have you read the inserts of the vaccine packages. HI will send you one and it lists the side effects.

Kalpana Verma
Kalpana Verma

my daughter has never been vaccinated. but I am not happy as awareness about not being vaccinated is negligible.this issue should be on large scale so that every child in our country should be vaccine free.

Cathy Perger
Cathy Perger
  • Kalpana Verma

I think Flu shots compromise the bodys natural ability to fight infection. The only time I think they should be administred is to children and older people with extreme health issues. The Goverment always says the stuff they want us to pump in our bodies is safe, don't believe it! Let the body do what is was designed to do without intervention from Government and Scientists.

Lori Harvey
Lori Harvey
  • Kalpana Verma

Children in the U.S. are the most vaccinated in all of the world yet they are the most sick. Why? Because of vaccinations. Deaths from childhood illnesses, even the one they did NOT come out with vaccines for all went down prior the vaccines coming out. Better food, better water & better sanitation. If vaccinated people were such a danger, then outbreaks would be bigger. As it is, the outbreaks of whooping cough & measles have been the fully vaccinated population NOT the unvaccinated. ...

Children in the U.S. are the most vaccinated in all of the world yet they are the most sick. Why? Because of vaccinations. Deaths from childhood illnesses, even the one they did NOT come out with vaccines for all went down prior the vaccines coming out. Better food, better water & better sanitation. If vaccinated people were such a danger, then outbreaks would be bigger. As it is, the outbreaks of whooping cough & measles have been the fully vaccinated population NOT the unvaccinated. Millions of people are not up to date on their boosters, yet most illnesses are kept in check. Polio has NOT disappeared, it has been relabed as aseptic meningitis. The fungal meningitis that is currently being publicized has been among the fully vaccinated population. Wow, no surprise there. Vit. D3 has been proven by a study done in Tokyo is 800% more effective at preventing the flu than the flu shot. Do your homework before you inject your kids with toxic substances.

Jared Hyames
Jared Hyames
  • Kalpana Verma

You're entitled to your opinion, and yet you are not entitled to your own facts. If vaccination is a conspiracy by the government, wouldn't the government want healthy workers? If the government needs money, needs taxes, needs fit healthy workers, wouldn't the smartest thing be making sure as many children see through childhood to become tax payers?

Joe Jared
Joe Jared
  • Kalpana Verma

Our daughter has never been vaccinated and never been sick. Making a person sick to prevent them from getting sick makes as much sense as going to war for peace.

Kalpana Verma
Kalpana Verma
  • Kalpana Verma

my daughter has never been vaccinated. but I am not happy as awareness about not being vaccinated is negligible.this issue should be on large scale so that every child in our country should be vaccine free.

Vipin Kanoujiya
Vipin Kanoujiya
  • Kalpana Verma

bravo mam.......mere bacche bhi vaccinate nahi honge mam....promise hahahahahahaha

Lara Lohne
Lara Lohne
  • Kalpana Verma

There is no way you will ever convince me, nor anyone who has suffered through any VPD or watched their child suffer through one, to not get vaccines for myself and my children. I hopefully have instilled in them enough common sense and logic so they too will be able to read and understand the value of vaccines for their own children. I don't believe I will live to see it, but I look forward to the day when the vaccine program has been proven so effective that the most dangerous and deadly...

There is no way you will ever convince me, nor anyone who has suffered through any VPD or watched their child suffer through one, to not get vaccines for myself and my children. I hopefully have instilled in them enough common sense and logic so they too will be able to read and understand the value of vaccines for their own children. I don't believe I will live to see it, but I look forward to the day when the vaccine program has been proven so effective that the most dangerous and deadly diseases are gone and the vaccines for them will no longer be needed.

Jared Hyames
Jared Hyames
  • Kalpana Verma

baahahahaha Homeopathic medical college ... come on.. is that a joke? Homeopathy is just water... and 200 years of no evidence otherwise...

come on, is this some big prank? are you guys having me on?
The people on the internet can't be this stupid can they?

Jared Hyames
Jared Hyames

You're entitled to your opinion, and yet you are not entitled to your own facts. If vaccination is a conspiracy by the government, wouldn't the government want healthy workers? If the government needs money, needs taxes, needs fit healthy workers, wouldn't the smartest thing be making sure as many children see through childhood to become tax payers?

Sarah Jones-Hill
Sarah Jones-Hill
  • Jared Hyames

People shit me. We are lucky enough to live in a country where our children are vaccinated and parents don't appreciate what a prvilidge it is. Freedom of choice should be replaced with the right to be an idiot.

Donna Eliassen
Donna Eliassen
  • Jared Hyames

I used to use the same argument in the days when I too was ignorant and thought my government wouldn't do what its doing and yada yada yada. The horrible truth (and it took me quite a few years before I would even contemplate swallowing it) is the drug/vaccine industry is a billion dollar industry. Governments, pollies and Drs all get huge handouts for promoting and using the drugs... it's a terrific form of income for them and it's very lucrative and that is why none of them are going to...

I used to use the same argument in the days when I too was ignorant and thought my government wouldn't do what its doing and yada yada yada. The horrible truth (and it took me quite a few years before I would even contemplate swallowing it) is the drug/vaccine industry is a billion dollar industry. Governments, pollies and Drs all get huge handouts for promoting and using the drugs... it's a terrific form of income for them and it's very lucrative and that is why none of them are going to stop it any time soon. It's why governments will now tell us smoking will kill us and we can't smoke here and there... but the taxes they make off smokers means they will never ban the sale of it.

Donna Eliassen
Donna Eliassen
  • Jared Hyames

Yes and sadly there are hundreds of thousands of parents around the world whose children are now dead or severely life injured, enjoying the right to be an idiot. :) They are now a lot wiser than you. They have done their research, out of necessity. You have clearly done none and it is pretty obvious who the idiot is.

Jared Hyames
Jared Hyames
  • Jared Hyames

you may be correct, it could be one big pile of kick backs, corruption and whatever else conspiracy feels nice tonight... Doesn't take away the science and the research and the countless individuals who developed the most effective health measures in history..

Jared Hyames
Jared Hyames
  • Jared Hyames

Sue, I hope your research didn't go along these lines....
SCIENCE - government, medical experts, pro vaccine, WHO, every medical teaching university, every hospital...

ANTI-Vaccine -- google search, unqualified cranks on the internet, homeopaths, naturopathy, Meryl Dorey (no qualifications at all), Vera Scheibner (geologist yay!)

Those two views are not ballanced...

Jared Hyames
Jared Hyames
  • Jared Hyames

AHHHH the post modernists won the post modernists won... ahhrrhrhrhrhhhgghghh

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Jared Hyames

Yes jared she was a biologist...you're right for once.
5. PREVIOUS RESEARCH INTEREST AND PUBLICATIONS: 1953-1986

My first scientific paper in Micropalaeontology of the Cretaceous Sequences of the Carpathian Klippen Belt in Slovakia was published whilst I was still a student at the JA Comenius University in Bratislava in 1958.

Between 1958-1968 I published some 35 scientific papers (and one monograph) dealing with the Cretaceous and Jurassic Foraminifera of the Carpathian Klippen Belt in...

Yes jared she was a biologist...you're right for once.
5. PREVIOUS RESEARCH INTEREST AND PUBLICATIONS: 1953-1986

My first scientific paper in Micropalaeontology of the Cretaceous Sequences of the Carpathian Klippen Belt in Slovakia was published whilst I was still a student at the JA Comenius University in Bratislava in 1958.

Between 1958-1968 I published some 35 scientific papers (and one monograph) dealing with the Cretaceous and Jurassic Foraminifera of the Carpathian Klippen Belt in Slovakia.

Between 1968-1987 studied Cretaceous and Permian Foraminifera of the Great Australian Basin in New South Wales, and South Australian and the Carnarvon Basins in Western Australia; South Africa and the Indian Peninsula; and Permian Foraminifera of the Sydney Basin.

Between 1972-1976 invited to participate in the highly prestigious Deep Sea Drilling Project (DSDP) conducted under the auspices of the Scripps Institution of Oceanography (USA), in the Atlantic and Indian Oceans. Results of these studies are published in the Initial Reports of the DSDP. Was invited to write a Synopsis of Cretaceous Foraminifera of the Indian Ocean, published in a monograph “Synopsis of the DSDP in the Indian Ocean”.

Results of my scientific findings spanning almost 30 years of research have been published in further 47 papers and 2 books (monographs) in Australian and overseas (especially USA) refereed scientific journals.

Lectured extensively at Australian and overseas conferences.

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Jared Hyames

Jared Hyams but then......

6. PROFESSIONAL AND RESEARCH ACTIVITIES: 1987-PRESENT

In 1985 I met my second husband, the late Leif Karlsson, a Swedish biomedical electronics engineer specialising in patient monitoring systems, whom I suggested to develop a breathing monitor for babies.

Since 1987 we were both engaged in the study of babies’ breathing with a microprocessor breathing monitor Cotwatch developed by the late Leif Karlsson.

1990-1993: published a series of articles on...

Jared Hyams but then......

6. PROFESSIONAL AND RESEARCH ACTIVITIES: 1987-PRESENT

In 1985 I met my second husband, the late Leif Karlsson, a Swedish biomedical electronics engineer specialising in patient monitoring systems, whom I suggested to develop a breathing monitor for babies.

Since 1987 we were both engaged in the study of babies’ breathing with a microprocessor breathing monitor Cotwatch developed by the late Leif Karlsson.

1990-1993: published a series of articles on vaccination and cot death in Natural Health Magazine.

1991: Invited to present the results of the data collection on babies’ breathing to the Second Immunisation Conference, a pro-vaccination conference organised by the Public Health Association of Australia (Canberra May 1991). An abstract of my presentation is published in the Proceedings of this conference (“Evidence of the Association between non-specific stress syndrome, DPT injections and cot death”.

Some results of these and allied studies, in which Cotwatch breathing monitor was used as a research tool collecting information on stress response in breathing, were published in a referred medical journal ”Reproductive Toxicology” (1993; 7: 449-452).

1993: Published the book “Vaccination” (296 pp) which is based on an extensive study of vaccination issues as published in refereed medical journals. This book has been published in German by Hirthammer Verlag, in Dutch by Lemniscaat Publishers and in Finnish by Kustantaja Lasse Vajaranta.

1994: Produced a 2-hour video of my lecture on the dangers and ineffectiveness of vaccination.

1994: The article “Embracing vaccination…lamentably wrong” published in the Chiropractic Journal (USA). Similar articles were published in other chiropractic journals. Lectured for students of chiropractic at a number of chiropractic colleges in the USA.

1995: Invited and accepted as an expert on vaccination and cot death by the College of Physicians Montreal (Canada) and on 11 December 1995 gave evidence on the subject of “Vaccination and Cot Death” before the Disciplinary Committee of the College of Physicians Montreal (Canada) as an expert for Dr Guillaine Lanctot.

Since 1996 I provide expert reports for Court cases of vaccine injuries and deaths. To this day I have been asked and prepared some 90 reports for Shaken Baby Syndrome (SBS) cases and/or vaccine injury compensation cases in the USA, UK, Germany, Iceland, Sweden and Australia.

1996: Invited to deliver a luncheon talk on dangers and ineffectiveness of vaccination to the medical staff of the Research Hospital in Kansas City, MO, USA.

1996-1997: Several lectures at Chiropractic Colleges in the USA.

In 1996 I participated in the Maroochydore (Queensland, Australia) hearing of the Equal Opportunity and Anti-discrimination Commission as an expert on the dangers and ineffectiveness of vaccination, and the link between vaccination and cot death.

1997: Followed an invitation to deliver a lecture at a seminar organised by a professional organization of Dutch medical doctors in Utrecht, Holland “Vaccination, yes or no?”

1997: Invited to present a lecture on the Dangers of Vaccination by the Faculty of Nursing, Sydney University.

1997: Participated in a public debate on vaccination at Sydney University in Sydney.

1997-1998: Invited to participate in the Training Program of the Royal Australian College of General Practitioners (RACGP), Sydney, New South Wales, as one of two expert panelists in debates on whether immunisation should or should not be mandatory, presenting the case against vaccination based on the study of published orthodox medical research.

1991 to 2005 published series of articles “The SIDS and Vaccination Link”, “The Brain Eating Bugs, the Vaccine Connection”, “Shaken Baby Syndrome – The Vaccination Link”, and a 2-part article on “Preservatives and Adjuvants in Vaccines” in the Nexus Magazine (Australia). In 2005 The Nexus Magazine in Australia and other countries reprinted my article “Dynamics of Critical Days as part of the Dynamics of Non-specific Stress Syndrome discovered during monitoring with Cotwatch Breathing Monitor”, first published in Journal of Australasian College of Nutritional and Environmental Medicine (J ACNEM), December 2004.

1998: Invited to address the Medical (MBOG) Congress in Utrecht (Holland) on the “Effect of Vaccination on the Immune System”.

1998: Invited to participate in a debate on vaccination convened by the organization WDDTY (“What Doctors Don’t Tell you”) in London, UK.

1999-2003: a number of Letters to the Editor, critical of vaccines, published in Medical Observer and Australian Doctor, two prominent weekly publications for Australian orthodox medical doctors.

2000: Published the book “Behavioural Problems in Childhood – the Link To Vaccination”. The book has been translated into Swedish by an organisation of parents dealing with children’s health.

2001: Published a paper “Shaken Baby Syndrome Diagnosis on Shaky Ground” in the Journal of Australasian College of Nutritional and Environmental Medicine (J ACNEM); 20(2): 5-8&15.

2003: Published a Letter requested by the Editor of the Journal “Vaccine” (1993; 22:VI-IX) countering the personal attack on myself as a public opponent of vaccination by Leask and McIntyre.

2004-2005: British Medical Journal (BMJ.com Rapid Responses) published a number of my letters to the Editor – see the enclosed list of publications.

Since 1994 I traveled extensively all over Australia, Europe, United Kingdom, Republic of Ireland, Scandinavia, the USA and Canada, holding seminars on the dangers and ineffectiveness of vaccination, as documented by orthodox medical research, for parents and health and medical professionals.

My task is perceived as that of liaising with paediatricians and other medical experts and of evaluation of the scientific research dealing with vaccination issues in general and more particularly with mass vaccination of infants and children. I have gathered a solid, extensive and irrefutable block of scientific evidence documenting vaccines as ineffective to prevent diseases, and which time and again issued warnings about a variety of real dangers, including brain haemorrhages and other brain damage, and retinal haemorrhages and other ophthalmological injuries and including death. The biological mechanisms of these injuries are principally immunological and toxic-chemical. My task is to analyse medical records and results of medical tests of the babies adversely affected or killed by vaccination and document the damage by case examples of the same vaccine damage described in orthodox medical literature.

An additional major subject of my research is immunological and other non-accidental injuries in babies who suffered medication (antibiotics and pain killers) and/or birth injuries and document the damage (including death) by case examples of identical non-accidental injuries as a result of iatrogenic (doctor-caused) immune or other disorders as described in medical literature.

Andrea Leong
Andrea Leong

I don't want to be a tool, but what is the purpose of this poll? I've read what's written above, but will this result be used in any way? I got an email reminder about this poll, asking me to share it, but I'm reluctant to do so, since it doesn't seem to be leading to anything. I'd suggest that anyone who's anti-misinformation, and want to contribute online, lends their support to groups such as Stop the Australian (Anti)Vaccination Network.

Andrea Leong
Andrea Leong
  • Andrea Leong

>.< I got a facebook notification saying there were replies to my two posts, but I can't see them :( Sorry :(

Andrea Leong
Andrea Leong
  • Andrea Leong

Ah, I can see the reply now, must just take a while to show up for me. Thanks for the reply, sorry I was a bit of a dick. Good call.

Daniel Weinstein
Daniel Weinstein
  • Andrea Leong

No worries. I'm trying to work out how to be an effective activist. It's not obvious. There are lots of people taking on the loonies who are a lot more knowledgeable about the science than I am. I'd like to find ways to influence the conversation without having endless arguments with ideologues. This poll was an attempt to get an audience and start more conversations. You never know where they'll lead.

Lara Lohne
Lara Lohne
  • Andrea Leong

Daniel Weinstein, I could direct you to a couple of pretty good science blogs if you would like. Send me a private message and I will give you the URLs for them.

Lara Lohne
Lara Lohne
  • Andrea Leong

Daniel, send me a private msg. I can direct you to a couple of science blogs where you can get really good information. Hopefully this comment shows up. It didn't the last time I posted.

Peter van Loon
Peter van Loon
  • Andrea Leong

Daniel, try Science Based Medicine, it's excellent. One of the doctors who writes there also does the Skeptics' Guide to the Universe podcast. Another writes the Respectful Insolence blog under a nom de plume. You will find not only thorough debunkings of standard anti-vax arguments, but lots and lots and lots of links to real science, something the anti-vaxers never seem to be able to do.

Andrea Leong
Andrea Leong
  • Andrea Leong

You know what, I retract my statement! It's the third and, most of all, fourth answers that I'm interested in, because they're the people we can engage with before their kids get whooping cough or measles or something (maybe even "sway them full-on provax" if you saw that :P (and for all the wary antivaxers reading this post, that's a joke in reference to something on a forum, so chillax)).

Lara Lohne
Lara Lohne
  • Andrea Leong

Shot of prevention is another good site.

Ruth Acaster
Ruth Acaster

My daughter is unvaccinated. I have never ready any scientific evidence to support vaccinating her. I have been studying vaccines for 15 years. Keep an open mind and don't believe something simply because your doctor says it. Do your own research.

Jared Hyames
Jared Hyames
  • Ruth Acaster

wow really? You willfully turned a blind eye to over 60 years of medical evidence and scientific support for vaccinations? Your 15 years research has been a complete waste...

Annette Bannon
Annette Bannon
  • Ruth Acaster

I think Ruth does her research, all 15 years of it, on the anti-vax sites, well obviously you are going to get only one answer!.....

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Ruth Acaster

"I have never read any scientific evidence to support vaccinating her"

Then you don't have all the information, and you are basing your decision on willful ignorance. If your daughter becomes sick from a VPD, then there is now written evidence of your neglect. The overwhelming majority of documentation done on the current vaccines in circulation supports vaccinating your child. And you'd think that if you've had 15 years to research it, I have to wonder... what have you been doing with that...

"I have never read any scientific evidence to support vaccinating her"

Then you don't have all the information, and you are basing your decision on willful ignorance. If your daughter becomes sick from a VPD, then there is now written evidence of your neglect. The overwhelming majority of documentation done on the current vaccines in circulation supports vaccinating your child. And you'd think that if you've had 15 years to research it, I have to wonder... what have you been doing with that time if you haven't found any of that overwhelming majority of evidence? Perhaps you are only looking for what you WANT to find.

The answers we want to hear are not always the same as the truth.

Page Crow
Page Crow
  • Ruth Acaster

Jared is an idiot. If he were smart, he would know that medical vaccination "research" is corrupt, biased and corporate-controlled. Medics are bitch to the corporations that run them and control their license. Follow the money.

Harry Phillips
Harry Phillips
  • Ruth Acaster

Another study where n=1... you have been nominated for a Nobel prize... wait by the phone.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Ruth Acaster

"Follow the money" could be applied to any of the sciences, even engineering. I suppose that because car manufacturers are in it for the money, we shouldn't be driving cars because they likely don't care enough about making sure the safety features work?

Oh, wait, that's what regulation is for. As it is for the medical community. And if you can make a case for the medical regulators being corrupt as well, then surely there is one for the roads regulators being owned by "Big Auto". Perhaps...

"Follow the money" could be applied to any of the sciences, even engineering. I suppose that because car manufacturers are in it for the money, we shouldn't be driving cars because they likely don't care enough about making sure the safety features work?

Oh, wait, that's what regulation is for. As it is for the medical community. And if you can make a case for the medical regulators being corrupt as well, then surely there is one for the roads regulators being owned by "Big Auto". Perhaps you should stop driving cars, just in case.

Follow the money can also apply to any "atl" med groups, such as homeopaths and chiropractors. Don't tell me they don't make a profit, and then don't try to tell me that they aren't corrupt, because it turns out they aren't bound by the same regulators as real medicine is. Funny how that works.

Jared Hyames
Jared Hyames
  • Ruth Acaster

Page.... COME AT ME CHIROPRACTOR!!!! bahhahahahaha
I love it how the chiropractors are in the anti vaccine mix... Where are the legitimate medical practitioners ???
Page, I know medics and I respect them and the years they dedicate to learning and continuing their education.. I've yet to meet a chiropractor I respect intellectually... Maybe it's because they can print their degrees online, or that they are holding to dogma of a guy who just made up his own treatment out of thin air..

Wendy Ferris
Wendy Ferris

Yes the majority of parents have made an informed decision. 42% percent would follow the entire vaccination schedule yet 43% will opt for no vaccines what so ever.

Wendy Ferris
Wendy Ferris
  • Wendy Ferris

Sue, I don't accept vaccines I personally think that by vaccinating children are putting thir health at risk. I believe thay mothers should EBF their babies to build up their natural immune system instead of putting genetically modified with god knows what in them into your babies tiny bodies. Build up the immune system naturally.

Gelaine Gushi
Gelaine Gushi
  • Wendy Ferris

Ahh.. The debate never ends.. Until the science "proves" the opposite of what's been "proven".. IT's happened many times before.. It will happen again. :) It's not easy depending on science when it changes all the time.. When I was a baby, breastfeeding was a no no.. Now, it's known to be most healthy for baby..

Lara Lohne
Lara Lohne
  • Wendy Ferris

I'm aggravated by the multiple times I've been typing up a comment or a reply and then the site refreshes and I lose everything. And I also really don't like fighting or arguing, it is a pointless exercise. I prefer honest and open discussion where views are received with respect and an open mind. That obviously can't happen here. That being the case, and with the obvious evidence that anti-vaccine groupies have been told to come and vote (because for some reason they put a great amount of...

I'm aggravated by the multiple times I've been typing up a comment or a reply and then the site refreshes and I lose everything. And I also really don't like fighting or arguing, it is a pointless exercise. I prefer honest and open discussion where views are received with respect and an open mind. That obviously can't happen here. That being the case, and with the obvious evidence that anti-vaccine groupies have been told to come and vote (because for some reason they put a great amount of stock in an unscientific poll) and in the process artificially inflated their numbers and polluted the results with self selection bias, there really is no point to continuing here. If anyone wants to chat or has a question, send me a message or friend request. A message is preferred first. If I don't know you, I may just decline your friend request all together. Peace out!

Annette Bannon
Annette Bannon
  • Wendy Ferris

Those who support not to vaccinate, claim they research the subject. Well, no, they 'goggle' conspiracy sites and make wild claims about vaccine reactions. The misinformation they post would be funny, if the subject wasn't so serious. As an example, I note below Ruth has posted misinformation about polio, I am sure she read her information from a conspiracy site.
Vaccination saves lives and permanent disability, to believe anything else is just nonsense.

Annette Bannon
Annette Bannon
  • Wendy Ferris

Wendy how to explain deaths from earlier this century from disease, in families who lived in good homes, had home grown food and clean water, walked every where in the fresh air? The Cemetery is full of dead children and adults who lived in those conditions?

Harry Phillips
Harry Phillips
  • Wendy Ferris

You know what else can happen "naturally" with VPD? Death.... yeah that's what they did back before vaccines... they died... oh naturally of course.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Wendy Ferris

also, if there was no rash, then it was not measles. you don't get a rash from a cold.

Darren Smith
Darren Smith

Vaccines are a major cause of disablement...

Jared Hyames
Jared Hyames
  • Darren Smith

yes true. Vaccines caused me to develop critical thinking and no I suffer painfully when I see uneducated, often deluded morons post their unqualified, unworthy opinions on the internet about the great big vaccine conspiracy..

Darren Smith
Darren Smith
  • Darren Smith

I cant see you comment here Jared ??? did you remove it ???

Jared Hyames
Jared Hyames
  • Darren Smith

no, i can summarise my comment in two words "herp derp"

Darren Smith
Darren Smith
  • Darren Smith

Tiz strange i have found your comment here on my wall post...facebook playing around i guess.....

Any way is it a conspiracy that 1 in 5 uk primary school kids have some form of learning disabitilty...thats 20% of 5-11 year olds, how would you like to exspailn that figure ???, and we have a measals outbreak that has claimed 45 children in the last 2 years....how do you figure that vaccines work..

Lori Harvey
Lori Harvey
  • Darren Smith

Daphne Hansen Vaccines did NOT save us. The death rate from childhood disease were on the way down prior to the widespread use of vaccines. (using the CDCs own data) Better food, better water & better saniation is what led to the delince in diseases including diseases that do NOT have vaccines for them. http://childhealthsafety.wordpress.com/graphs/

Christopher Panzer
Christopher Panzer
  • Darren Smith

Here are more stats. The graphs show death rates from specific diseases during the past century and the dates of their corresponding vaccine introduction. http://www.arizonaadvancedmedicine.com/articles/vaccinations.html

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Darren Smith

You're right Sue, I don t think he has any argument that requires response anymore. He wont answer any real questions and is only concerned with telling people to speak to "real" experts. Perhaps he could at least do something pro active by supplying us with a list of professionals that he considers worthy of opinion/trust? Only then might we have something worth considering from him.

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