Suzy Que
Suzy Que

From: http://www.askdrsears.com/?q=topics/vaccines/government-and-cdc-finally-agree-do-extensive-research-vaccine-safety-maybe.

"For those of you who are saying, “Wait – they HAVE researched it extensively and have proven there is NO link between vaccines and autism.” Well, that’s not exactly accurate. To date, no study has “proven” there is no link. Many studies have “failed to demonstrate a causative relationship between vaccines and autism” – in essence, showing there probably is no...

From: http://www.askdrsears.com/?q=topics/vaccines/government-and-cdc-finally-agree-do-extensive-research-vaccine-safety-maybe.

"For those of you who are saying, “Wait – they HAVE researched it extensively and have proven there is NO link between vaccines and autism.” Well, that’s not exactly accurate. To date, no study has “proven” there is no link. Many studies have “failed to demonstrate a causative relationship between vaccines and autism” – in essence, showing there probably is no link, or even there is almost definitely no link. But that is a very far cry from “proving for sure that there is no link.” What they HAVE done so far is use population-based statistical analyses (epidemiological studies) to determine that vaccines probably don’t cause autism. But no large prospective study has yet to be done using unvaccinated children as a large control group to have something to compare the vaccinated children to. This is really the gold standard for coming as close as we can to proving something is safe. And that’s the type of research the government had, up until now, refused to do. And we are not just talking about autism. There are so many other theoretical reactions to vaccines that have never been adequately studied. We’ve just written them off as so rare we won’t worry about them. Finally, after years of public pressure, the government has agreed to do the research.

Maybe.

Here are a few highlights of what the NVAC recommended the CDC begin doing research on (if it is found to be feasible):

Identifying subsets of our population that may be at higher risk of suffering a severe vaccine reaction, such as those with mitochondrial dysfunction, autoimmune diseases, autoimmune family histories, and genetic predispositions.

Accurately determine the statistical incidences of various reported severe reactions like encephalitis, encephalopathy, seizures, autoimmune reactions, demyelinating disorders, and autism.

The risks of reactions for babies with a prior reaction or with a family history of reactions in the parents.

Study various alternative vaccine schedules, including comparing reactions with multiple vaccinations to fewer vaccinations.

Study specific and individual vaccine chemical ingredients, including animal toxicology research (hey, I thought they would have already studied each and every vaccine ingredient in animals before they started giving them to us?)

These issues have always sat in the back of my mind as unanswered questions. And the absence of unvaccinated control groups in vaccine research has probably been the one single factor that has always weighed heavily in my mind regarding vaccines. To date, such control groups have always been infants receiving the current vaccine schedule minus the new vaccine that is being studied. But now there are just way too many vaccines to consider such a group as a placebo control."

Lets hope this study can be done and that us "anti Vaxes" are wrong, but until then, nobody here, for OR against, can claim such righteousness as has been a large part of this polls discussion. But in the meantime everybody has the right to their choice to decide what is right for them and their own family. Whether your fear is of the vaccines or your fear is of the diseases, at the end of the day fear is the what this society runs on and everybody needs to try and rise above that.
It's been an interesting read, and now I must get on with my life, but this has encouraged me to read more, question my sources more, and always try to keep an open mind, I hope everyone else can do the same.
Cheers Susie

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Suzy Que

I should also add, this was dated 2009.
http://www.hhs.gov/nvpo/nvac/documents/NVACVaccineSafetyWGReport041409.pdf
here is a link to the draft of what is hoped to be studied.
I would recommend anyone who is interested in educating themselves that the Drs Sears' are a very well respected family of Drs with unbiased veiws on vaccination and if any "crazy" on here says otherwise...well i guess you are just that :)

http://www.askdrsears.com/topics/vaccines

Bridie Burke
Bridie Burke
  • Suzy Que

More studies are never bad and are always needed. I hope they get on with it.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Suzy Que

Did you know...

That if something isn't there, it won't be found?

The number of studies, enormous studies, that have already been conducted on a link between autism and vaccines HAVE conclusively determined that there isn't one. It isn't for a lack of studies having been done - you cannot prove a negative, just like you cannot prove a god or deity of some kind doesn't exist, the burden of proof is on those making the claims that there is a god, and that there is a link. If no proof can be...

Did you know...

That if something isn't there, it won't be found?

The number of studies, enormous studies, that have already been conducted on a link between autism and vaccines HAVE conclusively determined that there isn't one. It isn't for a lack of studies having been done - you cannot prove a negative, just like you cannot prove a god or deity of some kind doesn't exist, the burden of proof is on those making the claims that there is a god, and that there is a link. If no proof can be delivered, especially after so much work has been done to find some, then it becomes more and more likely that such a link doesn't exist. At this stage, it can be considered conclusive, and a link has not been found not because not enough science has been done to look for one, but because there isn't one. It's like looking for a needles in a haystack, pulling the whole haystack apart and even using a metal detector to find it, and still not finding it. Do you keep searching because it hasn't been proven that there isn't a needle in the haystack, or do you stop searching because you know now that there definitely is no needle?

That's what this has become. Someone has decided that there is definitely a needle in that haystack, and doesn't like the idea of being wrong, can't accept that they are wrong, and are demanding that there is one there, even though the haystack has been thoroughly searched and found completely absent of needles. There is no link between vaccines and autism, and the science is finding more and more genetic links, and each time one is found, it further invalidates toxic causation.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Suzy Que

How about you find out how many unvaccinated children have autism before you ask a silly question like that.

In the United Kingdom, researchers evaluated 498 autistic children born from 1979 through 1992 who were identified by computerized health records from 8 health districts [Taylor B, Miller E, Farrington CP, et al. Autism and measles, mumps, and rubella vaccine: no epidemiological evidence for a causal association. Lancet 1999;353:2026-9.]. Although a trend toward increasing autism...

How about you find out how many unvaccinated children have autism before you ask a silly question like that.

In the United Kingdom, researchers evaluated 498 autistic children born from 1979 through 1992 who were identified by computerized health records from 8 health districts [Taylor B, Miller E, Farrington CP, et al. Autism and measles, mumps, and rubella vaccine: no epidemiological evidence for a causal association. Lancet 1999;353:2026-9.]. Although a trend toward increasing autism diagnoses by year of birth was confirmed, no change in the rates of autism diagnoses after the 1987 introduction of MMR vaccine was observed. Further, MMR vaccination rates of autistic children were similar to those of the entire study population. Also, investigators did not observe a clustering of autism diagnoses relative to the time that children received MMR vaccine, nor did they observe a difference in age at autism diagnosis between those vaccinated and not vaccinated or between those vaccinated before or after 18 months of age. These authors also found no differences in autism rates among vaccinated and unvaccinated children when they extended their analysis to include a longer time after MMR exposure or a second dose of MMR [Farrington CP, Miller E, Taylor B. MMR and autism: further evidence against a causal association. Vaccine 2001;19:3632-5.].

Read more here: http://cid.oxfordjournals.org/content/48/4/456.full

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Suzy Que

Or, you can ignore it in a fit of subjective validation that you can justify with a conspiracy theory of some kind. Either way, that's a pile of conclusive evidence against an autism-vaccine link right there. You don't have to like it - I didn't like it the day I found out my Nike shoes didn't make me better than anyone else, but the facts are facts, whether we like them or not.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Suzy Que

Fyi, studies are ongoing all the time, and new things are being discovered all the time. You should look up the latest Australian invention, a patch that requires far less vaccine and no injection, it goes into the skin instead of the muscle where there is more immune response. I'm not entirely up to date with the science of it all - it's very new and trials are still being done, although they've been approved for human trials now and received funding from a pharmaceutical company, which...

Fyi, studies are ongoing all the time, and new things are being discovered all the time. You should look up the latest Australian invention, a patch that requires far less vaccine and no injection, it goes into the skin instead of the muscle where there is more immune response. I'm not entirely up to date with the science of it all - it's very new and trials are still being done, although they've been approved for human trials now and received funding from a pharmaceutical company, which will improve their progress vastly. People fail to realise that it's not pharmaceutical companies that develop the vaccines, it's the pharmaceutical companies that provide funding for the ones that show promise after they've already been through extensive trials by scientists. No pharmaceutical company of its own accord has invented a vaccine. Australia's Ian Frazer was responsible for the HPV vaccine, and Offit invented the rotavirus vaccine. "Big Pharma" had nothing to do with the innovation, they just provided the funding for a demonstrably successful profit. It's called "investing", and businesses do it all the time - you should watch a show called Dragon's Den to see how cautious big business really is with high-risk endeavours. It'll give you an idea of how much work scientists have to put in before they see any money for their efforts from "big pharma"

Renee Friberg
Renee Friberg
  • Suzy Que

What would all of you do if you stepped on a very nasty, rusty nail?

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Suzy Que

Pull it out

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Suzy Que

Martin Bouckaert Read the outline draft of what they want to study in the link I provided Martin, exhaustive studies have not been done on ALL aspects of vaccines. MMR is only one aspect. Dr Sears talks about the GOLD standard, until this is acheived and definitve answers are found, I hold my postion and you can hold yours. see ya!

Alan James Greaves
Alan James Greaves

Stephanie Scoyne is the real evidence and her child that vaccines are not safe plus check with the CDC and you will discover vaccines do harm and kill. the difference between anti-vaccine and pro-vaccine zombies is most anti-vaccine activists have seen first hand what vaccines can and do to our children and we do our research unlike pro-vaccine zombies who are evil paid scum! or just plain evil. I back up everything Stephine has said pharmaceutical companies are immune from prosecution, do...

Stephanie Scoyne is the real evidence and her child that vaccines are not safe plus check with the CDC and you will discover vaccines do harm and kill. the difference between anti-vaccine and pro-vaccine zombies is most anti-vaccine activists have seen first hand what vaccines can and do to our children and we do our research unlike pro-vaccine zombies who are evil paid scum! or just plain evil. I back up everything Stephine has said pharmaceutical companies are immune from prosecution, do your research. see that's the only immunity vaccines give a license to kill legally. A safe vaccine is one that is never used and the science surrounding vaccines is nothing more than voodoo science, corrupt political propaganda. If you think Vaccines are safe then have them and help Bill Gates meet his target by reducing the population by 15% per annum and stop us listening to your lies.

Michael Simpson
Michael Simpson
  • Alan James Greaves

95% of children in the USA are vaccinated prior to entering kindergarten. Obviously, this poll, typical of everything on the internet, is skewed by whomever has the loudest voice. The default position of the vast majority of Americans is to get their children vaccinated and make them safe from communicable diseases. Smart choice.

What we need to do to get the remaining 5% vaccinated is get rid of the philosophical exemptions. That has no place in a rational world. And as for religious...

95% of children in the USA are vaccinated prior to entering kindergarten. Obviously, this poll, typical of everything on the internet, is skewed by whomever has the loudest voice. The default position of the vast majority of Americans is to get their children vaccinated and make them safe from communicable diseases. Smart choice.

What we need to do to get the remaining 5% vaccinated is get rid of the philosophical exemptions. That has no place in a rational world. And as for religious exemptions? Well, home school your kids or send them to religious schools (which mostly require vaccinations). I mean let's get real. How many mainstream religions actually don't allow vaccinations? And how many of these anti-vaxxers actually belong to them? Yeah, that's what I thought, none. Besides, public schools shouldn't allow any religious context to be a part of the student discussion. Keep creationism, prayer, and certainly some lame, non-existant, reason to cheat the system excuse to not get vaccines out of public schools. Oh, why can I say this? Because the Establishment Clause of the US Constitution keeps religions out of Public Schools for 50 years.

There we go. If you want your kid in public schools, vaccinate them. Otherwise, shut up, and do whatever you want.

Which apparently over 95% of Americans do. There we go, less than 5% of Americans belong to this fringe belief. Same group that believes in the Loch Ness Monster probably. :)

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Alan James Greaves

anecdotes from a mother who had a bad experience and is therefore emotionally biased in her opinions are not scientific evidence of anything at all. vaccines do have risks, but they are minimal and vastly outweighed by the benefits. no one here is evil, or being paid to have a different opinion to you. however, you are a moron.

Stephanie Marie
Stephanie Marie
  • Alan James Greaves

I followed my doctors recommendations my boys got all their shots, I thought they(the shots) were healthy and something you just had to do. My son's experience and the detrimental effects it had on him are real and you can not blow it off. The very way the body works is what is causing all these health problems people have now. The body is killing itself to rid itself of the junk injected. It is a normal reaction. Keep that in mind, the very way the body behaves when injected with toxins is...

I followed my doctors recommendations my boys got all their shots, I thought they(the shots) were healthy and something you just had to do. My son's experience and the detrimental effects it had on him are real and you can not blow it off. The very way the body works is what is causing all these health problems people have now. The body is killing itself to rid itself of the junk injected. It is a normal reaction. Keep that in mind, the very way the body behaves when injected with toxins is a NORMAL reaction and this reaction is what causes long term/life long effects. So vaccines are doing what they are suppose to do, even when "something goes wrong".

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Alan James Greaves

I'm not blowing off that something happened to your son, I'm just blowing off that it was caused by the vaccines unless you have medical evidence (and not just your gut feeling or some correlation) to the contrary. The body doesn't kill itself. If what you're saying is true, then EVERYONE who got vaccinated would have a serious reaction, and that just doesn't happen at all.

Mistie Delorey
Mistie Delorey
  • Alan James Greaves

I used to believe in vaccines until my son was severely vaccine damaged so although I would never have any future children vaccinated. I have indeed learned the hard way through vaccinating my son and my beautiful boy has made the ultimate sacrifice for this to of happened otherwise I would most likely and sadly still be for vaccinations. No one should have to make these deliberate sacrifices least of all ones child. What kind of greater good is that?

Wendy Ferris
Wendy Ferris
  • Alan James Greaves

39% will follow the vaccine schedule and 49% will never vaccinate!!! It is great to see that parents are doing there homework.

Mistie Delorey
Mistie Delorey
  • Alan James Greaves

http://www.facebook.com/Autism.Hurts.ABA.Helps For more info. about the risks associated with vaccines and up to date news involving autism and vaccines please visit the link in this post and keep informed. Good luck everyone we will all need it.

Andrea Leong
Andrea Leong
  • Alan James Greaves

Mistie, if the majority of the pharmaceutical industry were to say, tomorrow, "Actually, vaccines are a scam! Every effectiveness study in history that found positive results was bought off! We don't care if they're safe (we could have made them all inert, but we thought we'd throw in some scary-sounding chemicals for laughs), we just wanted to make money!" then I guess we'd have to believe them. Just like if the motor vehicle industry said they don't do any safety tests, they just want to...

Mistie, if the majority of the pharmaceutical industry were to say, tomorrow, "Actually, vaccines are a scam! Every effectiveness study in history that found positive results was bought off! We don't care if they're safe (we could have made them all inert, but we thought we'd throw in some scary-sounding chemicals for laughs), we just wanted to make money!" then I guess we'd have to believe them. Just like if the motor vehicle industry said they don't do any safety tests, they just want to sell cars. Or if the mobile telecommunications industry admitted that mobile phones definitely cause cancer, but they wanted to sell phones. The list goes on, Mistie --- what are you trying to prove with that argument?

April Garcia Adams
April Garcia Adams

Vaccinations are not a Prevention , or a cure! What it does is Supress your immune system from fighting back. Get Educated, I challenge you to, find out! Children are dying at a alarming rate! Autism is at a alarming rate! If you don't think one thing has to do with the other, than you are misinformed! Billionaire corporations using more preservatives, for a longer shelf life, for more Profits! Educate yourself, investigate! To all those who have lost their children: Iam so very sorry, God bless you, BE A VOICE, tell everyone!

Alan James Greaves
Alan James Greaves
  • April Garcia Adams

Your insane, vaccine do not save lives they kill and harm in many ways, you are the one who is wrong not i, vaccines are lethal poison and should not ever be injected into the body, the immune system needs only nutrition to be healthy. Poison in the blood stream will aways cause a reaction but that is not protection in any way. And you are very wrong a 4lb baby taking one vaccine would mean a 150lb man would have too take 25 of the same shot at the same time, we are not talking immune...

Your insane, vaccine do not save lives they kill and harm in many ways, you are the one who is wrong not i, vaccines are lethal poison and should not ever be injected into the body, the immune system needs only nutrition to be healthy. Poison in the blood stream will aways cause a reaction but that is not protection in any way. And you are very wrong a 4lb baby taking one vaccine would mean a 150lb man would have too take 25 of the same shot at the same time, we are not talking immune protection here but the equal amount of poison injected into the body, can a 4lb baby survive the poison without harm or death and could a 150lb man survive 25 of the same shot at the same time. Your nothing but a sick brain dead zombie who is full of lies and twists the truth for what reason only you know that but one thing is true every child that is not vaccinated is a life saved from harm and death, it is the vaccines that are killing not the fact that a body is pure blood. If a person suffers a disease then the natural health immune system will defend and fight it but if you shot someone with vaccine poison the immune system must fight all that poison plus if by some rare chance have to fight a disease. Many disease are very mild and never a threat to any one, any serious disease are vaccinated manmade poison. the biggest diseases are corrupt politicians, corporate scum and vaccines. Vaccines are the cause of spreading disease and we will win the fight, the more wake up the stronger the truth becomes, your lies kill and one day will get you killed too.

Alan James Greaves
Alan James Greaves
  • April Garcia Adams

Good nutrition,modern sanitation, uncontaminated water , waste disposal and personal hygiene all help kill disease never one vaccine, but your zombie who do not think. paid to lie.

Alan James Greaves
Alan James Greaves
  • April Garcia Adams

Take away the money to wipe out the diseases.

Alan James Greaves
Alan James Greaves
  • April Garcia Adams

Vaccine manufacturers have paid out nearly $2B in damages to parents in America whose children were harmed by one of the childhood jabs such as the MMR (measles-mumps-rubella) or DPT (diphtheria-pertussis-tetanus). In all, around 2,000 families have received compensation payments that have averaged $850,000 each. There are a further 700 claims that are going through the pipeline. None of the claims is for autism as medical researchers say they have failed to find a link between the disease...

Vaccine manufacturers have paid out nearly $2B in damages to parents in America whose children were harmed by one of the childhood jabs such as the MMR (measles-mumps-rubella) or DPT (diphtheria-pertussis-tetanus). In all, around 2,000 families have received compensation payments that have averaged $850,000 each. There are a further 700 claims that are going through the pipeline. None of the claims is for autism as medical researchers say they have failed to find a link between the disease and the MMR vaccine, despite the initial findings made by Dr Andrew Wakefield. Instead they are for a wide spectrum of physical and mental conditions that are likely to have been caused by one of the vaccinations. Around 7,000 parents have filed a claim of an adverse reaction with America's Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP). To win an award, the claimant must prove a causal link to a vaccine. As the medical establishment has refused to recognise any link to autism, the VICP has so far rejected 300 claims for this outright. (Source: New England Journal of Medicine)Medicine.

April Garcia Adams
April Garcia Adams
  • April Garcia Adams

Vaccinations are not a Prevention , or a cure! What it does is Supress your immune system from fighting back. Get Educated, I challenge you to, find out! Children are dying at a alarming rate! Autism is at a alarming rate! If you don't think one thing has to do with the other, than you are misinformed! Billionaire corporations using more preservatives, for a longer shelf life, for more Profits! Educate yourself, investigate! To all those who have lost their children: Iam so very sorry, God bless you, BE A VOICE, tell everyone!

April Garcia Adams
April Garcia Adams
  • April Garcia Adams

To those who think Vaccinations are safe, these are not the Vaccinations from 60 years ago! They are preservatives of Metals, for a longer shelf life---to make more profits without a loss! The dumb masses is what these billionaire industry's think of us, and if your fooled by a independent report-written by this industry, or a beautiful commercial, I hope you or your family never has to experience Death after Vaccine! Or the loss of holding and talking to your child-who now hasAutism,...

To those who think Vaccinations are safe, these are not the Vaccinations from 60 years ago! They are preservatives of Metals, for a longer shelf life---to make more profits without a loss! The dumb masses is what these billionaire industry's think of us, and if your fooled by a independent report-written by this industry, or a beautiful commercial, I hope you or your family never has to experience Death after Vaccine! Or the loss of holding and talking to your child-who now hasAutism, after the MMR Vaccine! Are people seriously fooled by this alarming, widespread epidemic created by big Pharma? Everyday? Well Iam educated! We live it everyday! And Iam apart of the Dumb Masses, that is not fooled by your advertisement on Happy Healthy Children! Junk Science- getting very rich on the Heartache you are causing! The truth will, come out for everyone to see!

April Garcia Adams
April Garcia Adams
  • April Garcia Adams

We are talking about vaccines and the Damage they are causing! Everyday! And that IS FACT! Not the car companies or what it was like 60 years ago( Jared & Martin) The Fact is.. Vaccinations ARE causing AUTISM and ARE KILLING CHILDREN! So apparently you don't care, have no children ( Now) and if you do, I really hope you never have to experience it, even if it takes that tragedy to open your eyes!

Lisa Brooker
Lisa Brooker
  • April Garcia Adams

Vaccines do not harm our children people! Why would doctors put years of research iinto something you all think will harm our babies! Vaccines were created to will help protect our children from the moment they are born. Or are they just injecting babies for the sake of it? I don't think so! Do you really think it would be legal to inject tiny babies with something that isn't good for them...

Amber Genevieve
Amber Genevieve

Until long-term safety studies are performed, I will not vaccinate my precious child. Not sure what is meant by vaccinating homeopathically...

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Amber Genevieve

Long-term safety studies are being performed all the time, and those of us that are vaccinated are its subjects. So far, they are passing with flying colours. No vaccine enters circulation without at least 3 phases of heavy duty trials. The rotavirus vaccine took twenty years to see any sort of usage.

And before you say "I didn't sign up to be a part of a trial," we are all a part of all kinds of trials. Life is a trial. Errors are made, and we learn from them. It's how science is done to a...

Long-term safety studies are being performed all the time, and those of us that are vaccinated are its subjects. So far, they are passing with flying colours. No vaccine enters circulation without at least 3 phases of heavy duty trials. The rotavirus vaccine took twenty years to see any sort of usage.

And before you say "I didn't sign up to be a part of a trial," we are all a part of all kinds of trials. Life is a trial. Errors are made, and we learn from them. It's how science is done to a large degree. And the evidence that proves vaccines are safe and effective far outweighs any evidence that they are not

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Amber Genevieve

vaccine = substance
homeopathy = dilution in plain water till nothing left of...
homeopathy vaccine = dilution in plain water till nothing left of substance..

Long term safety studies have been carried out.. Willful blindness to these facts is no excuse... Especially when your children are at greater danger without vaccines..

Erica Dickson-Hubbard
Erica Dickson-Hubbard
  • Amber Genevieve

If the rotavirus vaccine had twenty years of safety studies then they should have known that it cause a life threatening illness...intussusception, which is when your intestines twist. This is newborns, yep, that's safe! Rotavirus is not a big deal, you vomit, have diarrhea and get better. Not potentially die or require emergency surgery. Not a very good example to use :)

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Amber Genevieve

Erica Hubbard The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) licensed RotaTeq® (Merck & Co., Inc.) in February 2006 and Rotarix® (GSK Biologicals) in April 2008 for routine use in U.S. infants to prevent severe rotavirus disease in infants and children. Because a previous rotavirus vaccine, RotaShield® (Wyeth-Ayerst), was associated with intussusception, a form of bowel obstruction, the risk of this adverse event was specifically evaluated in a large pre-licensure trial for each vaccine. In these...

Erica Hubbard The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) licensed RotaTeq® (Merck & Co., Inc.) in February 2006 and Rotarix® (GSK Biologicals) in April 2008 for routine use in U.S. infants to prevent severe rotavirus disease in infants and children. Because a previous rotavirus vaccine, RotaShield® (Wyeth-Ayerst), was associated with intussusception, a form of bowel obstruction, the risk of this adverse event was specifically evaluated in a large pre-licensure trial for each vaccine. In these trials, each involving over 60,000 participants, conducted mainly in Finland and the United States for RotaTeq and in 11 Latin American countries for Rotarix, no increased risk for intussusception was observed. Post-marketing surveillance for intussusception is ongoing in many countries. On September 22, 2010, FDA approved a label change for Rotarix to advise practitioners of new data regarding intussusception from an evaluation in Mexico by GSK

So you see, the vaccine that WAS causing intussusception was withdrawn and replaced with one that doesn't. This demonstrates the regulators are doing their job, and the trial and error process of science, especially medical science. No one died from the intussusception that the vaccine caused.

As for the rotavirus.... "you vomit, have diarrhea and get better" do you? I've experienced a case of rotavirus in boarding school, over a decade ago before a vaccine existed. I went through it wishing I could just die.

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd-vac/rotavirus/unprotected-story.htm

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Amber Genevieve

I specifically like the part in that which says "No. Rotavirus vaccine should not be given to a baby who has had intussusception because there may be an increased risk of the condition recurring." Yep, and while there's a big pharma cover up of the harm that vaccines are doing, there's a complete openness about the legitimate risks associated with vaccination. That makes sense /derp

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Amber Genevieve

why... it's almost as if they don't want you to know what kind of legitimate harm the vaccines can do by telling you stuff like that... oh, wait, there's no conspiracy, and vaccine manufacturers aren't trying to cover up the risks. They are, in fact, quite open about them, as this document demonstrates.

Amber Genevieve
Amber Genevieve
  • Amber Genevieve

Martin we simply disagree. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of adverse events reported and growing to me means there are safety issues. In my opinion that's doesn't equate to' rare' as a great deal of vaccine supporters say the incidence is. And if you have long-term safety studies you can share with me that are done by non-biased third parties I would be more than happy to read them. The fact that Merck and a few others have been proven to have manipulated results in their...

Martin we simply disagree. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of adverse events reported and growing to me means there are safety issues. In my opinion that's doesn't equate to' rare' as a great deal of vaccine supporters say the incidence is. And if you have long-term safety studies you can share with me that are done by non-biased third parties I would be more than happy to read them. The fact that Merck and a few others have been proven to have manipulated results in their studies makes me feel that they are untrustworthy. Forgive me but that is how I feel. I didn't vote to engage in a debate, I simply wanted to vote and very briefly explain why.

Amber Genevieve
Amber Genevieve
  • Amber Genevieve

Really Andrea?? "Before rotavirus vaccine became available in Australia, almost every child was infected by rotavirus by the age of 5 years. About 10,000 young children were in hospital with rotavirus gastroenteritis each year and up to one young child a year died from complications." One death, ONE. And yes 10,000 hospitalizations isn't one however with proper medical care, it is very rarely fatal, and when it is it's usually due to dehydration. Now, if someone doesn't take their child to...

Really Andrea?? "Before rotavirus vaccine became available in Australia, almost every child was infected by rotavirus by the age of 5 years. About 10,000 young children were in hospital with rotavirus gastroenteritis each year and up to one young child a year died from complications." One death, ONE. And yes 10,000 hospitalizations isn't one however with proper medical care, it is very rarely fatal, and when it is it's usually due to dehydration. Now, if someone doesn't take their child to get medical care after a day's worth of diarrhea then they don't deserve to be a parent. You'd have to be pretty dumb to let that happen.

Bridie Burke
Bridie Burke

http://www.cfr.org/interactives/GH_Vaccine_Map/index.html#map

An interactive map of the outbreaks that are currently happening around the world. USA, mumps, measles and whooping cough. Who even knew mumps was still around in the developed nations. And look at Europe. Scary.

Mindy Utz
Mindy Utz
  • Bridie Burke

Show an interactive map of autism in all 50 states and around the world. Now you're just grasping at straws. It's tiresome. I'm dismissing you because you can't even debate with ALL the facts. Showing one side does not prove anything and you know it. Now...you're going in time out because I refuse to watch you talk in circles any longer. If you can be a big girl, I might let you out.

Andrea Leong
Andrea Leong
  • Bridie Burke

Mindy, why show the incidence of something unrelated to vaccines?

Bridie Burke
Bridie Burke
  • Bridie Burke

Mandatory vaccinations against which diseases? You'll find if you do (a very easy amount of research) that the MMR is not on the mandatory list for the countries experiencing outbreaks.
This from the WHO - WHO says that the surge in cases is due to not enough children having received vaccination, especially those who are now between the ages of 10 and 19. As a result of the accumulation of unvaccinated children over the years, the herd immunity for the population has been lost and the...

Mandatory vaccinations against which diseases? You'll find if you do (a very easy amount of research) that the MMR is not on the mandatory list for the countries experiencing outbreaks.
This from the WHO - WHO says that the surge in cases is due to not enough children having received vaccination, especially those who are now between the ages of 10 and 19. As a result of the accumulation of unvaccinated children over the years, the herd immunity for the population has been lost and the disease can spread quickly among the susceptible, causing severe illness and sometimes death. When herd immunity is lost, those who are too young to be vaccinated are at much higher risk of catching the disease.

This is a list of Mandatory vaccinations in Europe
http://venice.cineca.org/Report_II_WP3.pdf

So really all it shows, is that you haven't done your research, like most anti vaxxers. Thanks for proving that again.

Bridie Burke
Bridie Burke
  • Bridie Burke

Mindy - why post on my post when you have blocked me so I can't see what you have written? It is so bizarre.

Stephanie Marie
Stephanie Marie
  • Bridie Burke

http://www.cidd.psu.edu/research/synopses/acellular-vaccine-enhancement-b.-parapertussis Some people need to do a bit more research over the pertussis outbreak. The pertussis vaccine is encouraging parapertussis to colonize which makes them contagious for parapertussis the symptoms are the same so its all called whooping cough. So yes the vaccines are causing the outbreak.

Bridie Burke
Bridie Burke
  • Bridie Burke

I think you are the one that needs to do some research mate. Here you go, http://lymphosite.wordpress.com/2012/10/03/40_times_less_credible/ So you see, the vaccine still protects against the worse bacteria, hmm, let me see, protected against the more virulent and deadly strain, or not protected at all?? Which would I prefer?

Andrea Leong
Andrea Leong
  • Bridie Burke

Stephanie: That study has been taken out of context. Here's the original article: http://rspb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/early/2010/02/26/rspb.2010.0010.full

Mice were given the vaccine or a saline placebo, then infected via nasal spray. It's impossible to tell whether colonisation is more or less likely after vaccination, as every single mouse was colonised at the start of the experiment. The study observed how well/quickly the mice cleared the bacteria.

Indeed, there was 40x more...

Stephanie: That study has been taken out of context. Here's the original article: http://rspb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/early/2010/02/26/rspb.2010.0010.full

Mice were given the vaccine or a saline placebo, then infected via nasal spray. It's impossible to tell whether colonisation is more or less likely after vaccination, as every single mouse was colonised at the start of the experiment. The study observed how well/quickly the mice cleared the bacteria.

Indeed, there was 40x more B.parapertussis bacteria in the lungs of vaxed mice after 1-2 weeks (figure 1d). And, after infection with a mixture of B.pertussis and B.parapertussis, vaxed mice cleared B.parapertussis slower (1c). It's an interesting result that warrants further investigation.

Importantly, both vaxed and unvaxed mice completely cleared B.parapertussis a few weeks later, i.e. the outcome of B.parapertussis infection appears similar regardless of vax status.

Oh wait, what about the more virulent B.pertussis? Well, there was 700x LESS B.pertussis bacteria in the lungs of vaxed mice (1b). The vaxed mice completely cleared B.pertussis within 2 weeks, while the unvaxed mice were still getting rid of it after 5 weeks (1a).

Here's the authors' conclusion:
"It may be important to consider the introduction of vaccines that better protect against both bordetellae [...] An enhanced understanding of [...] aP vaccination is needed in order to optimize the next generation of vaccination strategies and fully reap the benefits of this powerful medical intervention."

PS - This comments app is the worst! Lost this post once, typed it in notepad the second time. I swear it's refreshing quicker and quicker each time.

Bridie Burke
Bridie Burke
  • Bridie Burke

And no reply.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Bridie Burke

Stephanie Scoyne what... another complete misinterpretation of the science by an antivaxer? I suppose you're not interested in the facts, just your subjective bias. But the fact is that the vaccine is not causing the outbreak. You're right about some people needing to do more research - I'm just not sure you're willing to look in a mirror and tell that to the person that needs to hear it most.

Suzy Que
Suzy Que

So here's a question....and jared I would be happy not to hear from you...you make no sense whatsoever, hopefully as you age your mind will open. (btw....qualifications? You keep assessing everyone else on their lack of...what are yours, naturepathy isn't it? At least that's what you FB says).
There is an ever increasing number of vaccines being created all the time, these are added to the schedule continuously. So when I was a baby, 1969, I had DPT and measles vaccination, (which by the way...

So here's a question....and jared I would be happy not to hear from you...you make no sense whatsoever, hopefully as you age your mind will open. (btw....qualifications? You keep assessing everyone else on their lack of...what are yours, naturepathy isn't it? At least that's what you FB says).
There is an ever increasing number of vaccines being created all the time, these are added to the schedule continuously. So when I was a baby, 1969, I had DPT and measles vaccination, (which by the way I still got measles and got it REALLY badly.)
Today the authorities recommend Hep B at birth, then rotavirus, tetanus, HIB, polio, Diphtheria, Whooping cough, Hep B, pneumoccoal: 8 diseases when a baby is 8 weeks old.
Then at 16 weeks another 8 diseases, 24 weeks another 8 diseases, then at 52 weeks another 6 diseases for a grand total of 31 doses of vaccines by 12 months of age in Australia, even more in the U.S.A.
“The immune system in young children does not work as well as the immune system in older children and adults, because it is still immature. Therefore more doses of vaccine are needed.” (Aust Gov dept of H and A).
So my question is: How many vaccines are too many? Are the people here that are comfortable with vaccination happy to give their children…or themselves 35 doses, 40 doses as more and more diseases that “must” be avoided are added to the schedule? When do alarm bells start ringing for you?

“Another reason why children get many immunisations is that new vaccines against serious infections continue to be developed. The number of injections is reduced by the use of combination vaccines, where several vaccines are combined into one shot.” (Aust Gov dept of health and aging.)

And it must be kept in mind that with each of these vaccinations the toxins that are being delivered to the baby’s body are also increasing. Toxins including: Aluminium hydroxide, hydrated (Al(OH)3), lactose, sodium chloride, aluminium hydroxide, aluminium phosphate, phenoxyethanol , potassium chloride, polysorbate 20 and 80, formaldehyde, glycine, sodium phosphate dibasic dihydrate, potassium phosphate monobasic, neomycin sulfate and polymyxin B sulfate.

“In the first months of life, a baby is protected from most infectious diseases by antibodies from her or his mother, which are transferred to the baby during pregnancy. When these antibodies wear off, the baby is at risk of serious infections and so the first immunisations are given before these antibodies have gone.”(Aust Dept of H and A).

http://www.gsk.com.au/resources.ashx/vaccineproductschilddataproinfo/362/FileName/D58F401484B3F7CD68FBC0A2D3A1D77D/Infanrix_Hexa_(Preservative_containing)_v4_0_clean_PDF.pdf
HEP B INGREDIENTS:
The active ingredient of ENGERIX-B is the surface protein of the hepatitis B virus, derived from genetically engineered yeast cells. The vaccine is not infectious, and will not give you the hepatitis B virus.
Inactive ingredients in the vaccine are: aluminium hydroxide, sodium phosphate, sodium chloride (salt), sodium acid phosphate, polysorbate 20 and water. A very small amount of thiomersal may also be present.
ENGERIX-B is made without any human blood or blood products, or any other substances of human origin.
The manufacture of this product includes exposure to bovine derived materials. No evidence exists that any case of vCJD (considered to be the human form of bovine spongiform encephalopathy) has resulted from the administration of any vaccine product.

Rotavirus vaccine – live attenuated oral: There is a potential risk for transmission to non-vaccinated contacts.

All of this info is taken from Government websites of the manufacturers of the vaccine. THIS is where I get my information from and what I have read and learnt from these websites causes me great concern.

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Suzy Que

I'm not sure that you want an answer to your question. Maybe you could ask an expert in that field? (an actual expert, one who could, for example explain to you the differences between aluminum hydroxide, aluminum peroxide and the scary sounding aluminum we wouldn't want to inject into our bodies)

There would be people out there who could reassure your fears. I would hope you would have the integrity and intelligence to be able to listen to someone qualified to talk on the subject.

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Suzy Que

I wouldn't have asked if i didn't want an answer. How many is too many to the people here? I have asked you 3 times now what your qualifications are to critisize professionals. Are you avoiding this question or what?

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Suzy Que

"The hepatitis B vaccine given at birth contains 250 mcg of aluminum – 20 times higher than safety levels … Babies who have followed the CDC immunization schedule are injected with nearly 5000 mcg (5 mg) of aluminum by 18 months of age."[8]
But it's all bullshit isn't Jared??
You tell me what is a safe level of Al in a human body?

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Suzy Que

There is established science.... (noting that there is no controversy within the scientific consensus) and then there are unqualified idiots making claims on the internet...
When making grand claims, like anti-vaxers do, it is not up to the person calling the bullshit to prove anything... The evidence is all on one side. It is up to the claimant to prove the new theory and undo all the known medical knowledge.

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Suzy Que

the quote about aluminum 20 times higher is probably made up.. if hep B vaccine contains 250 mcg and breat milk contains 10,000 mcg .... So which one is more dangerous? Better stop those mothers breastfeeding

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Suzy Que

I read your link and now here’s a link for you, and don’t disregard it because it has Mercola attached to it who you no doubt consider a quack, he didn’t write it:

http://mercola.fileburst.com/PDF/Aluminum_in_Vaccines.pdf

It’s by Neil Z Miller…a member of Mensa….but a quack by your standards just the same eh Jared?
If you bother to read it, you’ll see the above post regarding Al levels in vaccines was not made up as you accuse.

And finally this:

“Aluminum is not perceived, I believe by...

I read your link and now here’s a link for you, and don’t disregard it because it has Mercola attached to it who you no doubt consider a quack, he didn’t write it:

http://mercola.fileburst.com/PDF/Aluminum_in_Vaccines.pdf

It’s by Neil Z Miller…a member of Mensa….but a quack by your standards just the same eh Jared?
If you bother to read it, you’ll see the above post regarding Al levels in vaccines was not made up as you accuse.

And finally this:

“Aluminum is not perceived, I believe by the public as a dangerous metal. Therefore we are in a much more comfortable wicket in terms of defending its presence in vaccines”
DR JOHN CLEMENTS. WHO VACCINE ADVISOR.
Answer me this Jarod. Am I correct to think that you believe everything put out by Gov Dept’s and pharmaceutical companies, and everyone else speaks “nonsense”?
One other question, do you have children of your own yet?

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Suzy Que

So I have to read an article by Neil Miller because he is in Mensa? really? Sharon Stone is in Mensa too, that doesnt mean i listen to her views on medicine

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Suzy Que

did you know that aluminium is the third most abundant element on earth? it doesn't matter what you do, where you go, you're going to be exposed to it, and get it in your blood stream. babies ingest it in breast milk. should we therefore stop breastfeeding?

The dose makes the poison. Drink enough, and water can kill you too. Don't disregard the overwhelming majority of scientists that have done the work that demonstrates no danger from the levels of aluminium in vaccines just because you have a bias against vaccination.

Lori Harvey
Lori Harvey

Children in the U.S. are the most vaccinated in all of the world yet they are the most sick. Why? Because of vaccinations. Deaths from childhood illnesses, even the one they did NOT come out with vaccines for all went down prior the vaccines coming out. Better food, better water & better sanitation. If vaccinated people were such a danger, then outbreaks would be bigger. As it is, the outbreaks of whooping cough & measles have been the fully vaccinated population NOT the unvaccinated. ...

Children in the U.S. are the most vaccinated in all of the world yet they are the most sick. Why? Because of vaccinations. Deaths from childhood illnesses, even the one they did NOT come out with vaccines for all went down prior the vaccines coming out. Better food, better water & better sanitation. If vaccinated people were such a danger, then outbreaks would be bigger. As it is, the outbreaks of whooping cough & measles have been the fully vaccinated population NOT the unvaccinated. Millions of people are not up to date on their boosters, yet most illnesses are kept in check. Polio has NOT disappeared, it has been relabed as aseptic meningitis. The fungal meningitis that is currently being publicized has been among the fully vaccinated population. Wow, no surprise there. Vit. D3 has been proven by a study done in Tokyo is 800% more effective at preventing the flu than the flu shot. Do your homework before you inject your kids with toxic substances.

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Lori Harvey

Most of what you said has no basis in reality. I'm trying to look for something backed up by evidence here.. nope .. nothing.. Sorry..

Donna Eliassen
Donna Eliassen
  • Lori Harvey

She is actually citing research done by scientists and others in the medical community - I have read about this myself. Maybe if you did a little research yourself instead of relying on the crap drug companies tell you, you wouldn't need to rely on anyone's word of mouth... I did my own research. What's stopping you or do you prefer to live in ignorance? I believe some people find it blissful.

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Lori Harvey

Name two claims in the above nonsense that is backed up by any evidence?

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Lori Harvey

"outbreaks of whooping cough and measles have been in the fully vaccinated populations NOT the unvaccinated" WRONG... The unvaccinated population is way over represented in outbreaks..
"Polio has been renamed aspetic meningitis" WRONG... I guess they renamed the polio hospitals 'don't look here nothing to see'

thats two claims that are patently false..

Donna Eliassen
Donna Eliassen
  • Lori Harvey

You are clearly one of those stubborn argumentative types who himself has no evidence to support his own beliefs and so gullible you believe anything told to you. That's okay. I used to be like that too UNTIL I did my OWN research. Stop being so childish and arguing with people - just get off your lazy behind and use Google - there is a wealth of research posted on the internet - and by some very influential people in the industry. It is not up to the rest of the world to hold your hand and wipe your nose for you.

Andrea Leong
Andrea Leong
  • Lori Harvey

Donna, your attitude is terrifying. Whooping cough is about three times more common in the unvaccinated. If you're parroting the "but most of the cases are in the vaccinated, therefore the vaccination increases your risk of infection" line, you need to hit to the books.

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Lori Harvey

Use google.. Great advice.. Given that you have absolutely no qualifications in a medical field, what gives you the self delusion to disagree with every major medical body in the world, every medical teaching university, the head of every hospital's infectious disease department, the WHO, CDC, every countries ministry of health.. You, you cretin, you boob, you puny insignificant individual. With the mighty google take out all of them, tell them they are all wrong.. The stupid is monumental...

Caroline Jessica Shipley

The antivax numbers here are not very representative. Meryl Dorey has sent her flying monkeys in to jack up the numbers on the refusal side.

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Caroline Jessica Shipley

So Caroline, you think it would be more accurate if the people who don't vaccinate were not represented? doesn't make a lot of sense Caroline. unlike the people persecuting those who question vaccines, we don't need falsify statistics to prove a point. it's just a fact that the numbers are growing due to genuine concerns for the safety of our children.

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Caroline Jessica Shipley

it would be a benefit to have those who don't vaccinate left out yes. Why? Because 99% have absolutely no qualification or education to grant them the platform they seem to want to spout their nonsense... Ignorance and Evidence do not face off in a debate..

Andrea Leong
Andrea Leong
  • Caroline Jessica Shipley

"we don't need falsify statistics to prove a point"

...

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Caroline Jessica Shipley

It's a survey jared you fool! If this was purely to see how many people would vaccinate a young child today WITHOUT the other options you could have you pro vaccine rant in private without others offering a different veiw but is not what surveys/polls are about. Clearly you do not know how surveys/polls work

Petrice Foxworthy
Petrice Foxworthy
  • Caroline Jessica Shipley

Many people who choose not to vaccinate have done much more research on the subject of vaccinations than the people who vaccinate. I am a doctor who has chosen not to vaccinate. I have read the studies on both sides, looked at the evidence. There are many other doctors who are coming to the same conclusion. Doctors are not given all the info on vaccines while in medical school. We are taught that vaccines are safe and effective, end of story. But that is not the end of story. Why are there...

Many people who choose not to vaccinate have done much more research on the subject of vaccinations than the people who vaccinate. I am a doctor who has chosen not to vaccinate. I have read the studies on both sides, looked at the evidence. There are many other doctors who are coming to the same conclusion. Doctors are not given all the info on vaccines while in medical school. We are taught that vaccines are safe and effective, end of story. But that is not the end of story. Why are there no studies comparing vaccinated and unvaccinated children? Why have the last several outbreaks of whooping cough and measles occurred in 95% vaccinated populations? If vaccines were so damn effective, the outbreaks would not occur. So Jared, Caroline, Fara- people who choose not to vaccinate are not ignorant and uneducated.

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Caroline Jessica Shipley

Petrice, if you are actually a doctor, you are a disgrace to the medical profession. Please do not subject anyone to your unscientific ways of thinking.. In the arguments you put forward, you betray the lie you said earlier. "looked at the evidence" .. Clearly not. If you had looked at the evidence, you wouldn't be making such basic mistakes in logic, and fact.
Why are there no studies comparing vaccinated and unvaccinated? How do you want me to answer? With the epidemiological studies that...

Petrice, if you are actually a doctor, you are a disgrace to the medical profession. Please do not subject anyone to your unscientific ways of thinking.. In the arguments you put forward, you betray the lie you said earlier. "looked at the evidence" .. Clearly not. If you had looked at the evidence, you wouldn't be making such basic mistakes in logic, and fact.
Why are there no studies comparing vaccinated and unvaccinated? How do you want me to answer? With the epidemiological studies that do compare the two populations, or with the ethical reasons why a clinical trial could not be carried out? Did you seriously attend a medical school?

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Caroline Jessica Shipley

correction.. I just googled your name Petrice.. Nice try... You are a Chiropractor.. not a doctor... You implied quite dishonestly that you were a doctor, and insinuated medical school. That is the way of the anti-vaccinator.. always looking for that dishonest step up in the debate.... Seriously.. This page is bringing the lols... You're not a Doctor Petrice.... but nice try.... lol

Petrice Foxworthy
Petrice Foxworthy
  • Caroline Jessica Shipley

And do you know where I have gotten my info from- Medical doctors, medical journals, medical books.

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Caroline Jessica Shipley

Still Petrice, you tried to pass yourself off as a real 'doctor' .. You are not. Your ability to be honest is sorely limited. Granted, those observations don't invalidate your claims.... I've read quite a lor that say Chiropractic is bullshit. from - Medical doctors, medical journals, medical books..

Sharon Kocpek
Sharon Kocpek

every one get your flu shot please.

Dave Hawkes
Dave Hawkes
  • Sharon Kocpek

Influenza is a virus. It doesn't care whether you eat organic or not. This year has not been a particularly bad flu year which is great. However these viruses tend to go in waves. If you have small children, or come in contact with those that do, or the elderly or the chronically ill then getting the flu vaccine is a way in which you can contribute to these people having better health outcomes.

Scott Hansen
Scott Hansen
  • Sharon Kocpek

Seriously, your children are too important to simply rely on exercise and diet alone. Of course the flu vaccine is necessary.

Do we think turning to "legal drugs" is helping? In the case of vaccination - yes. Any person that would rather listen to drooling conspiracy theorists rather than actual health professionals seriously need to take stock of their priorities and wake up to reality.

Jared Hyams
Jared Hyams
  • Sharon Kocpek

to answer your questions in their order. People seems to be getting less sick. I have no friends with Polio, measles, typhoid... Do I think turning to legal drugs is really helping, yes. For sure. Can even back that up with the statistics too..

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Sharon Kocpek

Jared, so typhoid, measles and polio may not be the issue they once were, but we have replaced those diseases with other ones that are just as deadly, just as dangerous and in my view diseases to be very concerned about. MS is one of them, so is cancer, so is diabetes, so is Alzheimers. Parkinsons is another that is marked as increasing over the coming decades. Then there is autism, ADD, learning disorders………the list goes on. You cannot say, and neither can anyone else, that the reasons for...

Jared, so typhoid, measles and polio may not be the issue they once were, but we have replaced those diseases with other ones that are just as deadly, just as dangerous and in my view diseases to be very concerned about. MS is one of them, so is cancer, so is diabetes, so is Alzheimers. Parkinsons is another that is marked as increasing over the coming decades. Then there is autism, ADD, learning disorders………the list goes on. You cannot say, and neither can anyone else, that the reasons for the rises in these diseases has absolutely nothing to do with vaccination, environment, fluorides, food additives, chemicals on our food and in our food, vitamin deficiencies which may or may not be caused by any of the above mentioned possible causes. So until ALL of these things are proven to be 100% safe I will choose to avoid as much of these things that I feel the need to.

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Sharon Kocpek

Jared Hyams Cont'
“The disease, (MS) is probably caused by an immune disorder during which it attacks human cells. MS destroys the myelin that sheathes nerve fibres, causing an interruption in communication between nerve cells of the central nervous system and leading to the emergence of MS.”
http://www.msrc.co.uk/index.cfm/fuseaction/show/pageid/2325
The information below was dated 2007, if what they have found is in fact accurate the numbers would be even higher by now.
Nearly 1 out of...

Jared Hyams Cont'
“The disease, (MS) is probably caused by an immune disorder during which it attacks human cells. MS destroys the myelin that sheathes nerve fibres, causing an interruption in communication between nerve cells of the central nervous system and leading to the emergence of MS.”
http://www.msrc.co.uk/index.cfm/fuseaction/show/pageid/2325
The information below was dated 2007, if what they have found is in fact accurate the numbers would be even higher by now.
Nearly 1 out of every 1000 people in the US - around 266,000 people - suffers from multiple sclerosis (MS), Hirtz's team calculates. This figure is 50% higher than that estimated by a similarly large literature review published in 1982 (Neurology, vol 32, p 1207).
Rates of Motor neuron/Lou Gehrig's disease (ALS) and Parkinson's disease also appear stable. However, a recent study projected that the number of people living with Parkinson's disease will double from about 4.3 million to 9 million people worldwide over the next 25 years (Neurology, vol 68, p 384).
Nearly six out of every 1000 children have some form of autism. (2007)
About two out of every 1000 youngsters have Tourette's syndrome, which is characterised by uncontrolled movements and speech. Hirtz says the collection of reliable data on these disorders is relatively recent.
Hirtz's analysis also estimates that 67 out of every 1000 people aged 65 or older in the US suffers from Alzheimer's disease. She says that this represents a "substantial increase" in the prevalence of this disease and attributes this partly to the growing proportion of very elderly people in the US
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11052-marked-rise-in-ms-in-the-us-debated-by-scientists.html

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Sharon Kocpek

Jared Hyams And then there’s cancer……

According to French researchers, the incidence of cancer is expected to increase by more than 75% by the year 2030 in developed countries, and over 90% in developing nations. The study is published Online First in the Lancet Oncology.
• Even though very high HDI (human development index)countries only contain 15% of the world's population, they accounted for 40% of cancer cases in the world in 2008.
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/246061.php

...

Jared Hyams And then there’s cancer……

According to French researchers, the incidence of cancer is expected to increase by more than 75% by the year 2030 in developed countries, and over 90% in developing nations. The study is published Online First in the Lancet Oncology.
• Even though very high HDI (human development index)countries only contain 15% of the world's population, they accounted for 40% of cancer cases in the world in 2008.
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/246061.php

Dr. James R. Shannon, former director of the National institute of health declared, "the only safe vaccine is one that is never used."
Much of the success attributed to vaccination programs may actually have been due to improvement in public health related to water quality and sanitation, less crowded living conditions, better nutrition, and higher standards of living. Typically the incidence of a disease was clearly declining before the vaccine for that disease was introduced. In England the incidence of polio had decreased by 82 % before the polio vaccine was introduced in 1956.
By Dr. James Howenstine, MD

http://www.newswithviews.com/Howenstine/james.htm

And just to finish off here is a link to some notable quotes by medical Drs and scientists over the decades…….but of course they must all be conspiracy theorists because just like those amongst us here, they dare to question the norm.
http://www.itwillpass.com/quotes_doctors_quotes.shtml

Suzy Que
Suzy Que
  • Sharon Kocpek

Love Them, Protect Them, have a whooping cough booster to save them . Very pressumptuous to assume if i was sick that i would thoughtlessly cough over strangers, how about thinking a bit more before you put your thoughts into print.

Lori Harvey
Lori Harvey
  • Sharon Kocpek

This years flu shot (according to the insert that comes with the flu shot) says each shot contains 25 mcg of mercury in it. Not Thimerosal, MERCURY!! A neurotoxin. According to Dr. Hugh Fudenberg, he did a 10 year study on the flu shot & its relation to Alzheimer's. If you get the flu shot 5 years in a row, you are 10 times more likely to get Alzheimer's. According to a study done in Tokyo, Vitamin D3 has been proven to be 800% more effective in preventing the flu than the Flu shot. I...

This years flu shot (according to the insert that comes with the flu shot) says each shot contains 25 mcg of mercury in it. Not Thimerosal, MERCURY!! A neurotoxin. According to Dr. Hugh Fudenberg, he did a 10 year study on the flu shot & its relation to Alzheimer's. If you get the flu shot 5 years in a row, you are 10 times more likely to get Alzheimer's. According to a study done in Tokyo, Vitamin D3 has been proven to be 800% more effective in preventing the flu than the Flu shot. I never get the flu shot & I don't get the flu. Shocker.......

Andrea Leong
Andrea Leong
  • Sharon Kocpek

Lori, the mercury is present as part of thimerosal. It says the preservative is thimerosal. Stating the weight of mercury in this instance is like stating the weight of sodium in food --- sodium is present as a component of salt, not as elemental sodium, the highly reactive metal.

Re: Hugh Fudenberg: I, like the author of this blog (http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2007/08/27/bill-maher-antivaccination-wingnut/) couldn't find anything about the flu vaccine amongst Fudenberg's alzheimer's...

Lori, the mercury is present as part of thimerosal. It says the preservative is thimerosal. Stating the weight of mercury in this instance is like stating the weight of sodium in food --- sodium is present as a component of salt, not as elemental sodium, the highly reactive metal.

Re: Hugh Fudenberg: I, like the author of this blog (http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2007/08/27/bill-maher-antivaccination-wingnut/) couldn't find anything about the flu vaccine amongst Fudenberg's alzheimer's research (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=Fudenberg%20H%20alzhemier) can you please post a link to the relevant study or studies?

The authors of the Tokyo vit D/flu study that you mention are far more cautious in interpreting their results, due to the small sample sizes available: "our study suggests that vitamin D3 supplementation during the winter season may reduce the incidence of
influenza A."

Terry Kendall Schnitzler

The problem is, there is too much profit associated with vaccines. Behavior is far greater importance when it comes to HIV or HPV. Why the vaccine? The Pharma industry is capitalizing on fear and making designer vaccines, fueling fear and selling like hotcakes. The only child I have know to have whooping cough had already had the vaccine.
Knowing anything about how organisms like flu viruses work, there may be some benefit from the vaccine to the individual but logic says there is an...

The problem is, there is too much profit associated with vaccines. Behavior is far greater importance when it comes to HIV or HPV. Why the vaccine? The Pharma industry is capitalizing on fear and making designer vaccines, fueling fear and selling like hotcakes. The only child I have know to have whooping cough had already had the vaccine.
Knowing anything about how organisms like flu viruses work, there may be some benefit from the vaccine to the individual but logic says there is an element of forcing mutation which effects the whole of society.

Certainly there are illnesses that have been wiped out, thank you vaccines, education and hygeine, BUT the process of vaccination is one that should not be overplayed like anti-biotics, the over-use hurts everyone as we push these organisms to more quickly evolve until, like a ticking time bomb, we have a new series of resistant killers like Staph.

No longer is Pharma answering the call of need, but greed. Just look at how pills are pushed as the answer to every insecurity or ailment when really it is lifestyle and often a shift in trends. Sedating our elderly, sedating our children, sedating and who knows what else, the armed forced.

We already have serious problems due to the overuse of anti-biotics, antibacterials etc. we cannot afford to let Pharma run wild trying to sell us every vaccine of which they can make.

Lynne Batik
Lynne Batik
  • Terry Kendall Schnitzler

Vaccines are the lowest profit item in the pharmaceutical stable, far lower profit than antibiotics, anti-inflammatories, and all the drugs needed to manage serious illness. They are also the most intensively monitored of any medical intervention on the market. If "Big Pharma" were only and solely in it for the profit, their best bet would be to drop the vaccines and let the diseases take hold again.

And unlike antibiotics, vaccines cannot be overused. That's not how they work. They...

Vaccines are the lowest profit item in the pharmaceutical stable, far lower profit than antibiotics, anti-inflammatories, and all the drugs needed to manage serious illness. They are also the most intensively monitored of any medical intervention on the market. If "Big Pharma" were only and solely in it for the profit, their best bet would be to drop the vaccines and let the diseases take hold again.

And unlike antibiotics, vaccines cannot be overused. That's not how they work. They prevent transmission, they enable the body's own immune system to wipe out an infection before it takes hold -- mutation only happens after an infection, when the pathogen is replicating! Before a pathogen begins to replicate in the body, there is little chance of mutation. If replication is cut short, there is less chance of mutation than if the disease gets going. In fact, this is how vaccination cuts down on opportunities for disease mutation.

Flu only mutates every year because it is in constant circulation through people and animals it has infected; replication in an active infection is what gives it the chance to mutate.

It's important to understand how this works; if you don't understand why what I've just said is true, say so, I'll have a better stab at explaining.

Terry Kendall Schnitzler
Terry Kendall Schnitzler
  • Terry Kendall Schnitzler

You are so very sure of yourself, must be comforting. I understand what you are saying but there is more to it. Thank you for your information. I don't think it's wrong, but incomplete.

Martin Bouckaert
Martin Bouckaert
  • Terry Kendall Schnitzler

It's not about being sure of ourselves. It's about logic - very simple logic. How did these companies get so big in the first place if they're dodgy? Why do they care so much about vaccines in particular when most of their profits come from cosmetics? Why would they make something that they knew did more harm than good - the risk to their profits as a whole, including their cosmetic products, via reputation is too high. Ever use shampoo? Toothpaste? Hair product of any kind? All made by "big...

It's not about being sure of ourselves. It's about logic - very simple logic. How did these companies get so big in the first place if they're dodgy? Why do they care so much about vaccines in particular when most of their profits come from cosmetics? Why would they make something that they knew did more harm than good - the risk to their profits as a whole, including their cosmetic products, via reputation is too high. Ever use shampoo? Toothpaste? Hair product of any kind? All made by "big Pharma". And I don't think I need to get a financial report out to demonstrate why they would be higher-selling products than vaccines. Not to mention the billions that go into vaccines that never get passed trials and never enter circulation because they are, actually, useless or too dangerous.

Simple answer - they don't get that big by being stupid, and they don't stay that big by being stupid, and their is no big pharma conspiracy where they are wilfully endangering health in the name of profit. There are easier ways to make big bucks, and they've all been doing it for decades - cosmetics.

Lynne Batik
Lynne Batik
  • Terry Kendall Schnitzler

Terry, I study molecular biology. Knowing the basics of how pathogens replicate is kind of important. I'm curious as to what "more to it" there is that you think I'm missing about this science, and what your source of knowledge is.

Dianna Donnelly
Dianna Donnelly
  • Terry Kendall Schnitzler

to study is not to be an expert. please remember that.

Lynne Batik
Lynne Batik
  • Terry Kendall Schnitzler

"Not studying it" doesn't make you an expert either -- please remember that.

And, having studied something for real: "reading things on the internet" isn't studying. Unless you have the background and basics to enable you to tell the difference between good information and bad, and understand the whys and hows of how physiology works at a level which gives you a reasonable chance to judge plausibility, then reading on the internet is far more likely just to drown you in pseudoscience...

"Not studying it" doesn't make you an expert either -- please remember that.

And, having studied something for real: "reading things on the internet" isn't studying. Unless you have the background and basics to enable you to tell the difference between good information and bad, and understand the whys and hows of how physiology works at a level which gives you a reasonable chance to judge plausibility, then reading on the internet is far more likely just to drown you in pseudoscience and bad info. The noise:signal ratio on the internet in general is appalling. That's why a formal education in something, where you are taught mechanism and how things hang together, is just so damn useful.

No, what I'm learning is still sort of the basics. But it's the basics at a way different level.

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