Turkey's Erdogan Threatens to Block Finland & Sweden From Joining NATO

Do you think Turkey’s concerns justify blocking Finland and Sweden from joining NATO?

  • 41.9k
    jimK
    Voted No
    05/21/2022

    Erdogan: NATO’s very own Joe Manchin  - willing to use his threat of a veto to gain leverage for preferential treatment. 

    If NATO does not have the authority to expel nation state members for violating NATO’s charter, they should begin looking into doing so. ‘Strong men’ leaders do not respond well to anything but strength, it’s the only thing that they truly understand. 

    Look at Erdogan’s record. He refused to buy NATO air defense missiles and instead purchased Russian air defense missiles, with a Russian contingent to install the systems, train operators and provide at least initial maintenance in the very same area where Turkey’s NATO joint strike fighters were housed - I consider it to be a distinct NATO security threat  to have Russian missile air defense missile experts close enough to NATO joint strike fighter aircraft to possibly discern the best way to shoot them down. 

    After a call from Erdogan, the trump ordered US troops to abandon their positions along side our long standing Kurdish allies in Northern Syria, who for years led our fight to contain Al Qida, the Taliban and ISIS. There was no consultation with our National Security specialists or the military. There has never been any explanation for our county’s sudden abandonment of our long term and valued allies,  which we left to be slaughtered by Turkish mercenary forces made of freed Al Qida and ISIS fighters thirsty for vengeance. The Kurds appealed to only large military force left, Russia and were then removed from their ancestral home land to wasteland deeper within Syria - all done so Turkey could simply take a twenty to fifty mile wide strip of land along the Syrian border. 

    These actions certainly seems to be quite out of line with what NATO portends to be. 

    I really think that Erdogan is just looking for leverage by calling the Swedes out for giving sanctuary to Kurds who I would think would have to carry some animus for Erdogan’s pivotal role in breaking their long time alliance with the US and his attempt to eradicate the Kurdish people altogether.  … So what! … Actions have consequences and Erdogan will have to just live with that.

    Time for the big boys of NATO to have a serious discussion about Turkey’s future role as a member of the NATO alliance - or, I   guess Russia could just annex Turkey outright 

  • 91.7k
    LeslieG
    05/21/2022

    Turkey has avoided using the “V” word (veto) suggesting they are negotiating with Finland, Sweden, US though US State Department has said joining NATO is not a bilateral negotiation.

    Highly suspect Turkey will support after receiving arms sales from Scandinavian countries & US, and pledges to protect Turkey’s security concerns over groups Turkey considers terrorists.

    Turkey has danced around saying “veto” instead saying Turkey:

    “is not of a favorable opinion” 

    “does not hold positive views”

    Turkish concerns:

    1) called Nordic countries: 

    “home to terrorists organizations”

    “guesthouses for terrorist organizations” 

     “They are even members of the parliament in some countries. It is not possible for us to be in favour,” 

    Turkey considers Kurdish refugees terrorists and has requested extradition 

    2) US & EU host supporters of a religious sect that is widely believed to have been behind a 2016 coup attempt in Turkey.


    3) Sweden block arms sales to Turkey because of Kurdish human rights issues 

    4) didn’t want to make mistake like it did readmitting Greece also considered a terrorist state by Turkey 

    5) wants Finland & Sweden to lift ban on sales of arms to Turkey 

    6) ending U.S. support for the Kurdish militia in Syria that Ankara sees as terrorists 

    7)  lifting of the U.S. sanctions imposed after Ankara's purchase of the S-400 Russian defense system as well as potentially expediting Ankara's request to buy F-16s. 

    8) Finland calls for patience suggesting a deal in the making 

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russia-finland-nato-sweden-turkey-b2078248.html

    https://www.militarytimes.com/news/your-military/2022/05/13/turkeys-leader-opposes-letting-finland-sweden-join-nato/

    https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/us-says-turkeys-approach-sweden-finland-nato-bid-not-bilateral-topic-2022-05-20/

    https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2022/5/20/pkk-central-to-turkish-opposition-to-sweden-finland-joining-nato


  • 2,389
    Martha
    Voted Maybe
    05/22/2022

    If, indeed Finland and Sweden do support terriorist groups, then yes, this would be a concern.  However, if they don't provide support and safehavens to terriorist groups then it should not be an issue.  If there is lingering concerns, I would think NATO could remove either or any country that harbors/supports terriroist and if they can't, then they need to make that a part of their policies for joining and remaining members.  While, I don't know alot about Trukey, if memory serves me correctly, Turkey is not squeeky clean when it comes to human rights, etc.  However, I could be totally wrong about that.  At any rate, the concerns should be thoroughly investigated and if unfounded and both countries pledge to not support/harbor terriorist groups, then there should be no problem.  If however either country does support terriorist groups then membership should be delayed until either country can prove that they have ceased their support and again, continued membership assured only if any NATO country does not support terriorist groups in any form-overt or covert.  Additionally, what groups are designeated as terriroist should be based upon NATO definations, not any one countries definition.

  • 2,797
    Robert
    Voted Yes
    05/21/2022

    These concerns by Turkey about letting Finland and Sweden join NATO are valid. 

     

    Besides Turkey's concerns now Germany and France have voiced concerns. 

     

  • 91.7k
    LeslieG
    05/22/2022

    While Turkey has been troublesome over Finland & Sweden joining NATO they are a strategically valuable member so I hope that an agreement can be reached so Turkey doesn't veto Finland and Sweden joining like an arms deal with security guarantees as Turkey's membership in NATO provides:

    1) control of the Bosphorous which Turkey controls and has closed to Russian warships angering Putin

    2) refugee camps for Syrians. There would be far more Syrian refugees flooding Europe which Russia & Belarus have tried to accelerate by providing passage to Poland.

    3) Turkish drones that have been instrumental to Ukraine in the war. In addition Ukraine is partnered with Turkey to produce these drones in Ukraine, and has not sold any to Russia again angering Putin.

    Matter of fact, much of Turkey's dancing around the "V" word (veto) is to appease Putin and at the same time negotiate with Finland, Sweden, US for arms sales & security guarantees involving those Turkey considers terrorists (Greeks, Kurds, Turkish Sect in US).

    https://www.causes.com/comments/9195

  • 24.9k
    Frank_001
    Voted No
    05/23/2022

    Regarding the Misinformation about NATO Expansion.

    This is from the NATO Web site.

    https://www.nato.int/nato_static_fl2014/assets/pdf/pdf_2016_07/20160627_1607-factsheet-enlargement-eng.pdf

    <Direct Quote>

    NATO Enlargement & Open Door
    NATO’s “open door policy” is based on Article 10 of the Alliance’s founding document, the North Atlantic Treaty (1949). The Treaty states that NATO membership is open to any “European state in a position to further the principles of this Treaty and to contribute to the security of the North Atlantic area”. It states that any decision on enlargement must be made “by unanimous agreement”.
    NATO enlargement has helped increase stability and prosperity in Europe. It is aimed at promoting stability and cooperation, and at building a Europe united in peace, democracy and common values

    <End Quote>

    https://www.nato.int/nato_static_fl2014/assets/pdf/pdf_2016_07/20160627_1607-factsheet-enlargement-eng.pdf

     

  • 982
    Harry
    Voted Yes
    05/23/2022

    It is Turkey's citizens being injured and killed, there needs to be clarity and a united cause on safeguarding all Nato Allies.

     

    It is not dufficient for one man's revolutionary vs. one man's terrorist.

  • 1,020
    Nick_Papagiorgio
    Voted Maybe
    05/21/2022

    You know there is a rule of law argument to be made against Nato expansion. NATO and the us have both signed treeties with Russia over 20 years ago promising not to expand nato. While there is little historical precedent for it, it isn't crazy to expect America (and by extension nato) to simply keep its word. 

  • 3,375
    Surender
    Voted No
    06/03/2022

    Turkey rebrands as 'Türkiye,' changing name at the United Nations

    turkey may be turkiye but erdogan is still a turkey! 

  • 35
    James
    Voted No
    05/26/2022

    Absolutely No! Turkey has always played the money game, even back to WWll and more recently. Sweden and Finland are viable choices. There should be no hesitation.

  • 35
    Richard
    Voted No
    05/26/2022

    While it is important for each member's concerns to be addressed, one member cannot be permitted to prevent action that the entirety of other members support.  Address Turkey's concerns, and approve the admission of Sweden and Finland

  • 32
    Mehdi
    Voted No
    05/26/2022

    Erdogan is just doing this to remain in good terms with Russia

  • 32
    Jeffery
    Voted No
    05/26/2022

    I think he sucks

  • 31
    Jim
    05/26/2022

    NATO doesn't need more members especially ones that will obviously threaten the security of other nations

     it's obvious that Russia will see it as a threat to their national security 

    and have already expressed their concern 

    we members of NATO are supposed to be a peacekeeping force 

    so surely we should be trying to calm the war in Ukraine 

    not throw logs on too the fire 

    it seems to me our interest is more on country's resources and it's mot

    about people .

     

     

  • 2,206
    wpeckham
    Voted No
    05/25/2022

    Erdogan is as much a  dictator as is Putin, and the two are allies. He is insecure and feels threatened by anyone who wants free and fair elections in Turkey or is critical of his government.  Yes, even those who have fled to other countries to live peacefully away from his death squads.   A demand that other nations not supply or finance terrorists or freedom fighters in his country (he has BOTH to deal with) is not unreasonable, but demanding that no new NATO country allow refugies from his country is unreasonable and would require NATO to break existing treaties and agreements. It shoudl be interesting to watch this play out, but for the record I approve of NATO and exapanding NATO to reduce the likelyhood of war. 

  • 3,405
    Adel
    Voted No
    05/25/2022

    Erdowan is a criminal himself!  Cutting off the heads of reporters because you don't like what they say?  Yes, he is a criminal.

  • 144
    DrCGJ
    Voted No
    05/25/2022

    Erdogan is a bully anyway.

  • 3,658
    Kevin
    Voted No
    05/25/2022

    The Turks have grown closer to Russia.

  • 63
    careerera
    Voted No
    05/24/2022

    Every country has rights to secure themself for future perspective in terms of security for its country along with people. So I will oppose to Turkey...

  • 890
    Bobbie
    Voted Maybe
    05/24/2022

    NATO/US  trying to beef up its military dominance. Please stop it!!

  • 862
    Daniel
    Voted Maybe
    05/24/2022

    The USA MUST not Vote For allowing Finland and Sweden into NATO. What do those Countries have to offer current NATO Countries??!! Or do you think it is more about two more Countries that the USA Taxpayers shovel money to?!!! Great idea, Borrow Money from our Enemies, then, Give That Money Away with No Strings Attached. Nevermind the USA Citizens and Taxpayers don't want this. Why would the USA Fed Govt be concerned about what USA Citizens want? And if there happens to be more agressions the USA Citizens get Fleeced Again but for even bigger money. Hopefully not USA Citizens fighting to protect Foreign Borders getting killed. That wouldn't bother Joe a bit. In Fact, he wouldn't even miss lunch to spend time with the Families of the dead Soldiers. Probably a good thing because he makes an ass of the entire USA anytime he opens his mouth. So, NO!!! Do not expand NATO!!!

  • 1,034
    ClydeK
    Voted No
    05/24/2022

    This appears to be a move akin to blackmail  Erdogan will support this action once he is paid his bribe price.  I also fear Hungary may jump on this same bandwagon.  Turkey is vital to NATO due to their controlling access to the Black Sea.

  • 679
    DOMINIC
    Voted No
    05/24/2022

    He's in bed with Putin.  

  • 20.1k
    Kristen
    Voted No
    05/23/2022

    Erdogan is a scumbag. Only reason he's part of NATO is because of his enormous nuclear arsenal and the geopolitical implications of that arsenal being under the control of an arrogant asshole.  Not because he's a Democracy trailblazer. 

    Do not forget what he did to the Kurds. 

  • 46.2k
    Brian
    Voted No
    05/23/2022

    I'm sure we can send Dr. Oz to talk to him. I hear they're close.

  • 46.2k
    Brian
    Voted No
    05/23/2022

    Erdogan doesn't believe in democracy and is too close to Russia. Might be time to reevaluate the way NATO membership is determined.

     

    I support Finland and Sweden, and hope they can join.

  • 767
    Mark
    Voted No
    05/24/2022

    Why do they care about former citizens moving to Finland or Sweden?

  • 7,559
    larubia
    05/23/2022

    Too bad we can't ask Turkey to leave. They are playing a game of "only what's good for Turkey" instead of thinking about working with other countries to keep peace. NATO really needs to sit Erdoğan down to explain the expectations of NATO membership.  You don't vote solely on what's best for your country or what you can gain in a bargain. If he can't do that, then give Turkey the boot.